citation defeatism will not be tolerated, comrade
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Yeah, the books are going to be the hardest. If it's not trivially easy to find a copy online, see if you can find a link to purchase it used, and post the link here. Some newspapers especially New York Times articles have online archives.

Mainly, in my opinion, should skip the difficult ones and post the list of those skipped. Earlier, I was able to get a great quality scan of a rare source from an academic library, within hours of my request too. So at a certain point, once we've acquired what we can on our own, we can batch request the remaining material from various libraries and see what gets provided. Whatever we can't get that way- maybe we should finish up by asking J Sakai directly? Thanks for taking the time yall, I really like this project
no one is going to read the fucking citations

i'm doing this mostly as an exercise since i'm usually white noise. something about this current neo-LF influx has me wanting to do a little bit more.
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roseweird posted:

swampman, most of these are citations to books and newspapers, rather than journals... some of them are on jstor, but i don't have access to any of them... the books have to be bought, borrowed, or pirated, and most of the newspaper/magazine articles would prob have to be accessed on microfilm at a library (searching a lot of the citations on google turns up settlers itself and nothing else). i found only a few of the citations in jstor and i've found only one that i can access so far (WILLIAM R. SCOTT. "Black Nationalism and the Italo-Ethiopian Conflict." Journal of Negro History. 1978)... need to scrub the IP and time of download from the file, will upload after i figure out a neat way to do that. i'll see which of those books i can find elsewhere though

try lexis

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I can do html citation linking with
<a class="note" href="#note1">(1)</a>
but how do we insert asterisk citations into the html



<a href="[url]http://www.crepusculum.org:3711/domus/lf/BLA_AMessageToTheBlackMovement.pdf[/url]">1. Message to the Black Movement: A Political Statement from the Black Underground, pg.16</a>
<a href="[url]http://www.crepusculum.org:3711/domus/lf/GUTMAN_TheNegroAndTheAmericanLaborMovement_pg49-57.pdf[/url]">2. HERBERT G. GUTMAN - "The Negro and the American Labor Movement" (Collection/Essays), ISBN 68-12042, pg.49-57</a>
<a href="[url]http://www.crepusculum.org:3711/domus/lf/NYDEN_BlackCoalMinersInTheUnitedStates.pdf[/url]">3. PAUL NYDEN - ""Black Coal Miners in the United States", N.Y., 1974. pg.7</a>; All information on the UMW, unless otherwise noted, is from the CPUSA paper; <a href=[url]http://www.crepusculum.org:3711/domus/lf/THENEGROALMANAC_ProgressivismInTheCIO.pdf[/url]">HARRY A. PLOSKI & WARREN MARR II - "The Negro Almanac" 5th Edition. N.Y., 1976, pg.410</a>
<a href="[url]http://www.crepusculum.org:3711/domus/lf/GUTMAN_TheNegroAndTheAmericanLaborMovement_pg81-82.pdf[/url]">4. GUTMAN, op. cit., pg.81-82</a>
<a href="[url]http://www.crepusculum.org:3711/domus/lf/GUTMAN_TheNegroAndTheAmericanLaborMovement_pg49-57.pdf[/url]">5. ibid., pg.53-55</a>
<a href="[url]http://www.crepusculum.org:3711/domus/lf/PRESIDENTSCOMMISIONONCOAL_TheAmericanCoalMiner_Pg20.png[/url]> 6. PRESIDENT'S COMMISSION ON COAL - "The American Coal Miner", Washington, 1980, pg. 20; <a href="[url]http://www.crepusculum.org:3711/domus/lf/RadicalAmerica_Vol9No3.pdf[/url]>EILEEN WHALEN & KEN LAWRENCE - "Liberation For the Oppressed Nations and Peoples of Southern Africa"- from Radical America, Vol.9, No.3 (summary of original presentation)</a>
<a href="[url]http://www.crepusculum.org:3711/domus/lf/GUTMAN_TheNegroAndTheAmericanLaborMovement_pg49-57.pdf[/url]">7. GUTMAN, op. cit., pg. 57-58</a>
<a href="[url]http://www.crepusculum.org:3711/domus/lf/RadicalAmerica_Vol9No3.pdf[/url]>8. WHALEN & LAWRENCE - from Radical America, Vol.9, No.3 (summary of original presentation)</a>
<a href="[url]http://www.crepusculum.org:3711/domus/lf/AllOfAfricaIsStandingUp_Vol2No4Pg4.jpg[/url]">9. "All Africa Is Standing Up" - Vol.2, No.4, pg.4, May 1978</a>
<a href="[url]http://www.crepusculum.org:3711/domus/lf/FONER_OrganizedLaborAndTheBlackWorker_Pg418-419.png[/url]">10. FRONER - "Organized Labor and the Black Worker", pg.418-419</a>
<a href="[url]http://www.crepusculum.org:3711/domus/lf/FONER_OrganizedLaborAndTheBlackWorker_Pg418-419.png[/url]">11. ibid., pg.418</a>
12. Interview (unsure of the interview Sakai is referencing here)

roseweird posted:

was following up on sakai's allegation that the delano family made its fortune in opium smuggling, and found this 1997 nytimes article that agrees roosevelt descended from 19th century opium lord but manages to act pissy about the rule of hong kong and ends by lecturing the chinese on market morality.

Warren Delano returned to America rich, and in 1851 settled in Newburgh, N.Y. There he eventually gave his daughter Sara in marriage to a well-born neighbor, James Roosevelt, the father of Franklin Roosevelt. The old China trader was close-mouthed about opium, as were his partners in Russell & Company. It is not clear how much F.D.R. knew about this source of his grandfather's wealth. But the President's recent biographer Geoffrey Ward rejects efforts by the Delano family to minimize Warren's involvement.

The family's discomfort is understandable. We no longer believe that anything goes in the global marketplace, regardless of social consequences. It is precisely this conviction that underlies efforts to attach human rights conditions to trading relations -- to temper the amorality of the market -- a point that, alas, seems to elude the Socialist soon-to-be masters of Hong Kong.

"We no longer believe that anything goes in the global marketplace, regardless of social consequences."

haha the chinese presumably banned the opium trade for a reason before the opium wars. this sentence makes it sound like it was all above board at the time (like it was legal but immoral), or that the traders didn't know that the opium was gonna be used illegally (they knew exactly what was happening).

edit: just double checked and the opium trade was not legalised in mainland china until 1858 after the second opium war "Treaty Of Tientsin". if this guy got rich in hong kong before 1851 he likely was making his $$$ after the first opium war when the trade was legalised in hong kong by the british colonisers but still illegal in mainland china (the major market for opium).

Edited by Chthonic_Goat_666 ()

Marx actually wrote a bit about the opium trade and british imperialism in china:

How silent is the press of England upon the outrageous violations of the treaty daily practiced by foreigners living in China under British protection! We hear nothing of the illicit opium trade, which yearly feeds the British treasury at the expense of human life and morality. We hear nothing of the constant bribery of sub-officials, by means of which the Chinese Government is defrauded of its rightful revenue on incoming and outgoing merchandise. We hear nothing of the wrongs inflicted "even unto death" upon misguided and bonded emigrants sold to worse than Slavery on the coast of Peru, and into Cuban bondage. We hear nothing of the bullying spirit often exercised against the timid nature of the Chinese, or of the vice introduced by foreigners at the ports open to their trade. We hear nothing of all this and of much more, first, because the majority of people out of China care little about the social and moral condition of that country; and secondly, because it is the part of policy and prudence not to agitate topics where no pecuniary advantage would result. Thus, the English people at home, who look no further than the grocer's where they buy their tea, are prepared to swallow all the misrepresentations which the Ministry and the Press choose to thrust down the public throat.

Meanwhile, in China, the smothered fires of hatred kindled against the English during the opium war have burst into a flame of animosity which no tenders of peace and friendship will be very likely to quench. For the sake of Christian and commercial intercourse with China, it is in the highest degree desirable that we should keep out of this quarrel, and that the Chinese should not be led to regard all the nations of the Western World as united in a conspiracy against them.

and a couple articles about it:



if you're interested roseweird ill try to find some stuff more specifically about this warren delano guy.


here's an article about warren delano's involvement in the opium trade... written by FDR's grandnephew(!) in 1986.

despite the family connection it appears accurate (at least about the wider events of the opium war, not so sure about the delanos or american trade in china in particular)
John Kerry's great grandfather : https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Francis_Blackwell_Forbes


Makeshift_Swahili posted:

http://www.americanheritage.com/content/%E2%80%9C-fair-honorable-and-legitimate-trade%E2%80%9D?page=showhere's an article about warren delano's involvement in the opium trade... written by FDR's grandnephew(!) in 1986.

despite the family connection it appears accurate (at least about the wider events of the opium war, not so sure about the delanos or american trade in china in particular)

1879, more than thirty years after Warren had left Canton, his old friend Robert Forbes asked him to write up his memories of life there in the old days. Both men had since earned distinguished reputations and several fortunes in fields unrelated to the China trade, but Forbes had grown nostalgic for it. He hoped that Warren and all the surviving Russell men would contribute memoirs, he said; there were nearly one hundred of them; the results would be used to compile a colorful company history.

Warren sent him a terse summary of his career in China in which he did not mention his participation in the drug trade. Some of Forbes’s other former partners were still less obliging, wanting no part of any history that might prove too intrusive. Even Forbes finally thought better of his scheme: “The only thing I fear,” he confessed to Warren, “is that in giving a sketch of the causes and effects of the opium traffic…I may say too much.” He finally chose to say nothing.

lol.... *thinks deeply* on second thought, better not brag openly about being an opium lord...

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Ive told 4 of my honkey friends and one of my afrikan friends to read settlers and gave them the link but I think they didn't read it
in the spirit of education encouraged in this thread, I have picked up "settlers" again in order to finish in (up to the last chapters now)

the stuff about the growth of the middle management in the 80s is really interesting. i gotta read the Race Burns Class interview
Here's an interview Ernesto Aguilar did with Sakai a little while back. It clocks at an hour long but he isn't a particularly prolific speaker, and covers a lot of ground here. Also some good anecdotes.


This is OP talking about the book, probably already been posted tho


Edited by Urbandale ()

i saw a hard copy of the 2014 edition at a book store and bought it - that interview is transcribed in the appendix, so i can scan it if needed
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yes, it's now a html link to distressed cats singing the internationale
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isn't the logic of a settler state itself a disease? like acid reflux or something?
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tpaine posted:

In Taiwan, an NGO called Hand Angel trains volunteers to masturbate the disabled.

mods change my username to Hand Angel Keller tia

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how disabled do i have to be? i mean they have to be?
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Sam Kriss Hand Angel
put up like four fuckin chapters today check it out http://readsettlers.org/text-index.html
oh wow this thread came a long way since i last read it.
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yeah i'll get back to work on chapter 1 since it's assigned to me and all.