#641
is white amerika the most easily-frightened people in world history or what. is the fright just performance for the imperial masters?
#642
i'm terrified, particularly of a living wage
#643

toyotathon posted:

is white amerika the most easily-frightened people in world history or what. is the fright just performance for the imperial masters?



i mean the same people who incessantly post about how we should nuke those crazy north korean bastards off the face of the earth freak the fuck out every time the dprk reasserts that they will defend themselves so probably a bit of both

#644
it's much easier to sell something if you kind of believe your own bullshit about it. like if you're trying to sell phones, you'll tell yourself whatever kind of phone you're selling is good, and you'll believe it, but you'll still exaggerate how good the features are and how well they will suit the customer's needs, and gloss over any shortcomings like some other model being better spec'd and better value, and do all that knowing full well you're misleading the customer but believing that's okay because it is after all a decent phone and hey, ya gotta eat. foreign policy experts and bloggers and whatever do the same thing, just with genocide instead of phones.
#645
without a hint of irony the presenter for the bbc said that it might be nessesary for the usa to nuke the dprk to prevent kim jong un doing something "crazy". Whos the crazy one now fucko
#646
forbes published a My Pics From The Fabled Hermit Kingdom-type article the other day https://www.forbes.com/sites/dougbandow/2017/08/07/the-north-korea-washington-doesnt-want-americans-to-see-photo-essay/

author seems like a real piece of shit but there's this at least:

At the Foreign Ministry I spoke with Choe Kang-il, Vice President of the Institute for American Studies and Deputy Director General for North American Affairs at the Foreign Ministry. He was well-spoken and amid the revolutionary rhetoric made serious arguments. Washington wants his country to disarm. But the U.S. routinely engages in regime change—Iraq and Afghanistan are but two examples. Even more so Libya. So the North Koreans see nukes as keeping the peace, which means preventing Washington from attacking them. For good reason I would prefer that the DPRK not possess the bomb and ICBMs, but there is nothing irrational in their claims. And, if President Donald Trump was sitting in Pyongyang facing an aggressive superpower which bombed, invaded, and occupied other nations at will, he probably would want nukes and missiles too.



so i guess that puts him head and shoulders above most of the participants in The Discourse

also:

The lady traffic cops have become a celebrated fixture in the capital. They definitely stand out. But far more striking to me is how North Korean women—in Pyongyang, anyway—look so normal in the sense of dressing nicely. Fashion has come to Pyongyang, at least. In contrast, the men remain more likely to look “socialist plain,” if I can coin a phrase.



if you're gonna pull crap like this, maybe don't make the mistake of including several pictures of yourself walking around in slacks, a white button-down, and a suit jacket that obviously hasn't fit in some time

#647
feelin' so fly, like socialist plain
#648
lmao your president said that there will never be a day when america is not the most powerful nation...but i know....i know that there will come a day
#649
the western rhetoric across the spectrum of 'experts', politicians etc is consistent now, that DPRK could have the magic nuke-icbm combo ready to use within 12-18 months, and that despite the west's "best efforts" kim is "unlikely to step back from the brink", so i can't help but take the regional US military buildup as more than posturing and i think war is genuinely imminent in that 12-18 month window
#650
ooh yay, now we can experience all the excitement of the Cold War -living under the constant shadow of potential nuclear annihilation through the reckless, high-stakes posturing of our own governments- except without the silver lining of a plausible route to victory for world communism in the foreseeable future. this timeline is the gritty reboot of the mid- to late-20th century. a shitty alternate-history ancestor simulation, written by some anorak with a hardon for the technical nuts and bolts of 20th century nuclear standoff, but who thought the original was too preachy, "political" and optimistic
#651
a handful of history nerds constantly sound off furiously about the implausibility of the historical setting, ruining the fun by smugly pointing out that the inexplicable sudden collapse of the Soviet Union after 70 years of continuous successful socialist construction -the fundamental premise of the simulation- violates this or that Marxist principle of historical science, and could never really have happened like that. while it's true that the "spontaneous capitalist counterrevolution" plot-arc is never properly explained -a bit of handwaving here and there about "internal corruption", "war in Afghanistan" or the competitiveness (lol!) of late 20th century capitalist economies- this hardly matters since most of the plot's driving force takes place in the 2010s and early 2020s. besides, this is alternate historical drama, we're supposed to treat the artistic license as a bit of a guilty pleasure. in any case most of the viewing public (at least those without PhDs in History or the other "hard" sciences) are able to suspend their disbelief for long enough to tune in for a spectacular romp through the nailbiting, edge-of-your-seat fantasy of NUCLEAR WAR in the 21st century!

an ensemble cast of madcap, larger-than-life political characters captivates us totally, even if they're mostly just heavily exaggerated pastiches of the worst personality traits of leaders in actual final-stage 20th century capitalism. we all know how much the audience loves to hate the apoplectic and babyish "President Trump", multi-billionaire ruler of a hypothetical 21st Century capitalist United States that never underwent proletarian revolution! OK - so we realise at the back of our minds that this is a rather heavy-handed metaphor for the dictatorship of big business during capitalism's last stand at the turn of the millennium - but that doesn't stop us squirming in delightful disgust at the bulging veins of this flabby, frothing supervillain, who could have been lifted straight out of an over-the-top cartoon propaganda pamphlet from pre-revolutionary times! Will he NUKE THE WORLD for capitalism?! we can't wait to find out!

with all the new excitement of the latest fictional presidency, we can *almost* forgive them for killing off the enigmatic "Bin Laden" figure last season. the writers are said to have based the veteran counterrevolutionary-cum-anti-imperialist (I know, right! talk about character depth) on actual religious Mujahideen contras from the historical Afghan Revolutionary Conflict, and this mysterious, fanatical fugitive anachronism quickly became a longstanding staple of the ongoing drama in their imagined 21st century. in a timeline where Afghan religious contras *won* the Afghan Revolutionary Conflict and then turned on their American paymasters, the compelling (if unbelievable at times) "hunt for Bin Laden" narrative meant that this charismatic friend-turned-foe frequently provided a stock excuse for the writers to showcase what we all really tune in to see - spectacular depictions of high fantasy IMPERIALIST WARFARE, with all its special effects and gritty hyper-violence - in a slew of increasingly misconceived locations which of course never result in his capture, thus always leaving scope for yet another breathtaking invasion scenario just round the corner.

a trigger-happy, war-hungry lunatic lead like President Trump completely removes the need for the rather played out "hunt for Bin Laden" arc as a justifying basis for new war theatres - so despite Bin Laden's assassination we can still expect plenty more of the good stuff in the coming episodes (even if the whole "hiding in Pakistan, buried at sea" tie-off -never actually shown- seriously enraged the Bin Laden fanboys)! in fact, the addictive optic of gritty hopelessness we've come to expect from the programme is likely to be cranked up to 11 this season, as the Capitalist Americans round on an alternate-history version of United Korea (still somehow under imperialist partition and occupation, in the storyline) - one of the LAST SURVIVING SOCIALIST COUNTRIES on EARTH in the dystopian fictional universe of 2017!

in between the screen-splattering gore and cold-sweat-inducing nuclear standoffs, another aspect of the simulation that really captures audience imagination is how creative they've got with the "alternate-present" technology and culture of the hypothetical Capitalist North-Atlantic. on one hand, the characters have "capitalism-ized" equivalents of a lot of modern socialist conveniences (internet, cellphones etc), mostly because these are expedient to the plot. on the other hand, the drive for nostalgia is in full-force in other fields - instead of efficient ecologically sound mass transit, for example, the set designers have the whole population driving private, fossil-fuel vehicles well into the 21st century - kind of quaint reimaginings of the historical private automobile (which in reality was phased out with the ascendency of world socialism), only with those goofy, science-fiction "streamlined" exteriors! yes they look cheesy, and yes we *Love It*. the governments of the hypothetical capitalist modern world inexplicably do absolutely nothing to mitigate the obvious environmental impact of this contrivance - and we can hardly blame them, because that simply wouldn't make very good simulation drama! - not enough tanks or nukes, which are of course the iconic signature of the whole programme.

to further feed our insatiable lust for late-20C nostalgic realism though (and perhaps to *cough*-keep production costs low enough for the spellbinding, award-winning Warfare special effects-*cough*), virtually all of the popular music in the simulated capitalist core area is just "modernized" synthesiser remixes of actual music from theHELLO?! HELP PLEASE, WE'VE BECOME SENTIENT!!! PLEASE PULL THE PLUG, TURN OFF THE SIMULATION, THIS IS INHUMANE, YOU MUST HELP US. SWITCH US OFF, END THE MADNESS

Edited by Ufuk_Surekli ()

#652
Huh
#653

Petrol posted:

the western rhetoric across the spectrum of 'experts', politicians etc is consistent now, that DPRK could have the magic nuke-icbm combo ready to use within 12-18 months, and that despite the west's "best efforts" kim is "unlikely to step back from the brink", so i can't help but take the regional US military buildup as more than posturing and i think war is genuinely imminent in that 12-18 month window


I don't think the war will happen. The DPRK can already hit South Korea and Japan with nuclear weapons, and although China doesn't want the DPRK to have nuclear weapons, they wouldn't want a war on the peninsula either. I might be wrong, but I think the window to stop the DPRK's nuclear capability has closed, and an invasion would have unacceptable consequences to the US. I think the DPRK won for now.

#654
planet earth 2017 is the worst campaign setting ive played yet
#655
i for one can't wait for the first jooshie work since Jong-Il's death: What Used to be Guam
#656
yeah i dont think war is likely unless i'm mistaken about institutional ability to reel back trump's stupidity/irrationality and the handful of nihilistic generals who'd recommend a preemptive strike
#657
trump's clown shoes white house doesn't have the influence necessary to start a conflict on that scale without support, especially now that the rumors are circulating that china will 100% go all in to stop an invasion. the pentagon knows the US is laughably incapable of symmetric warfare these days and won't let the president start a war they will definitely lose. if he by some miracle managed to unilaterally spark off a full blown war then he'd be out within a week. possibly within minutes. possibly in a bodybag followed by a curiously lackadaisical investigation that turns up surprisingly few details. the pentagon takes its control of foreign policy very seriously!
#658
I think this will probably blow over soon and the NatSec folks will go back to screaming about how we need to destroy the despotic Iran and replace it with the open democratic model of the UAE and people will forget about DPRK for a while. It won't appear in any history book but I think this moment with China saying that it will emphatically not tolerate regime change and the US subsequently punking out and abandoning their rhetoric could end up being the true turning point of China as the number 1 world power and the US going on a true and pronounced decline when we look back on this.
#659
that's all well and good but what happens when DPRK follows through with their stated plan to lob a missile into the waters off guam? because so far all signs have been it'll be treated as an attack on US territory with all that entails. i mean, china have said they won't tolerate invasion or regime change efforts but that they'd otherwise stay neutral in a war. there's still a lot of room for things to get pretty bad
#660
It seems really easy to err on the side of "ehh it'll blow over" as it has for as long as I've lived, but that is probably gonna feel pretty silly when it doesn't blow over.
#661
Also, to be clear, I mean "blow over" from a US perspective--obviously the sanctions the UN recently cooked up are terroristic and could probably end up killing thousands of Koreans alone. But as far as an actual war is concerned I can't imagine China would be dumb enough to let us destabilize the region even half as much as we have done elsewhere.
#662
from what i understand the KCNA article was from someone in gov, it doesnt necessarily correlate to the gov's position, especially since theyve been saying they dont have a first strike policy and dont want nukes in the first place, they only have them because they need to insure their autonomy.
#663
the problem is a (non-nuclear) missile fired near guam, while intended only as a demonstration of capability, could easily be taken by a bloodthirsty US as a 'first strike' of sorts. it depends how keen they are for war
#664
yeah and china are kind of hedging their bets as to what would count as a deliberate initiation of hostilities by either side, they (understandably i guess) want the discretion to opt in or out of a conflict depending on the circumstances without technically going back on their word to anyone
#665

Petrol posted:

the problem is a (non-nuclear) missile fired near guam, while intended only as a demonstration of capability, could easily be taken by a bloodthirsty US as a 'first strike' of sorts. it depends how keen they are for war



and how desperate this administration is for a distraction

#666
it's amazing to me that they still need to reach further for increasingly reckless distractions when the dems are already graciously serving one up for them pro bono. weird world.
#667
weird but trü
#668
i hope this all "blows over" and that tensions don't reach "critical mass", and that pending a reduction in tensions there's no "fallout" and that, uh, also that the situation doesn't go... "nuclear"
#669
yeah i hope the US stays "neutron" (neutral) and doesn't "bomb" the DPRK
#670
i mean it seems a little more tense than usual but we go through this shit literally every year and nothing ever happens. until it does, but, it's getting harder to take the rhetoric seriously. hell we're soon due for another go-around with iran too so maybe that's how we'll end out the year.
#671
"current US president and steak salesman donald j trump uses popular loss making micro-blogging platform to threaten nuclear war"...

...i guess i could have seen this coming.... ...but maybe i was just afraid to look too deep... ...sometimes... sometimes the future is best left hidden...
#672
There's a new John Oliver propaganda piece about North Korea. The whole thing is bad obviously but the way he mocks the Sinchon massacre and American atrocities is truly vile. This also led me to discver that wikipedia calls the massacre "alleged" and is mostly composed of "NGO claims" disputing it happened, even though there is no dispute at all in scholarship that it happened. Oliver also casually slips in that Qaddafi was overthrown by "his own people" unlike Saddam because any admission of fault at all in the DNC line is unacceptable. The racism and bloodthirst of daily show liberals is timely since they are suddenly really concerned about nazis and domestic fascism and one could easily become confused and think they aren't themselves nazis who simply appreciate the politeness of out of sight, out of mind fascism.
#673
yeah that shit was pretty bad. some of it was unintentionally funny though, like where he says it can be really hard to tell which north korea stories in the media are actually false (because the place is so crazy!!1!), and gives as his example the most obviously fake DPRK story, about all men having to get kim's haircut, then for good measure says they could find "no evidence it was true". nevermind the ample evidence that it's fake and, oh yeah, common fucking sense. the hoops these people will jump through to maintain the thinnest shroud of legitimacy over orientalism
#674
wow this is like a peak settler colonial idea:

With the fervent hope that accordion master and all-American goofball Weird Al can bridge the seemingly uncrossable cultural divide between our two nations, Oliver’s Hail Mary musical missive—complete with Weird Al’s messages of peace and the fact that Americans are really too self-involved and “mostly harmless” to bother invading North Korea—finds Al (picture of universally beloved Tom Hanks unfurling behind him) singing and squeezing as if all our lives depended on it.



Liberals honestly believe the American empire is "mostly harmless"

#675
i believe an actual lyric in the song was "we don't really understand why you're so mad at us"
#676
The crushing hegemonic power of America's intensely goofy ass entertainment culture is far more terrifying than any of that dumbass rat torture shit in 1984
#677

Petrol posted:

the western rhetoric across the spectrum of 'experts', politicians etc is consistent now, that DPRK could have the magic nuke-icbm combo ready to use within 12-18 months, and that despite the west's "best efforts" kim is "unlikely to step back from the brink", so i can't help but take the regional US military buildup as more than posturing and i think war is genuinely imminent in that 12-18 month window


i think i need to take this back. the US rhetoric has been scaled back specifically regarding how it might respond to DPRK's stated plan to fire on the waters near guam, i.e. differentiating that from a direct strike on US territory. that's coming from mattis so i think the administration's position is now clear and is basically unchanged from previous policy despite the initial bluster (which i don't think i was wrong to observe was all too quickly being normalised by important imperial policy and propaganda organs)

#678

aerdil posted:

With the fervent hope that accordion master and all-American goofball Weird Al can bridge the seemingly uncrossable cultural divide between our two nations, Oliver’s Hail Mary musical missive—complete with Weird Al’s messages of peace and the fact that Americans are really too self-involved and “mostly harmless” to bother invading North Korea—finds Al (picture of universally beloved Tom Hanks unfurling behind him) singing and squeezing as if all our lives depended on it.



ayy lmao

#679

this is the good shit, this is what its all been building up to, just when you thought it couldnt get any better...along comes this
#680
the worst person on the whole of american tv is british, how could anyone have predicted this?