complex society needs specialization of labor, not everyone can be a homebrew lathe operator. there's a chance everyone might benefit from a sufficiently dumbed-down explanation of how manufacturing plants work, even if we do happen to work in stereotypically male occupations
I didn't write any of my posts with your case of covid in mind, I'm sorry if it seemed like I was personally attacking you in that regard. It genuinely wasn't my intention. I hope you recover quickly!

Constantignoble's interpretation of my post is right. I feel like you're reading right past what I'm actually saying and putting the worst meaning you can think of on it. Honestly, I think you're inventing my position for me on the fly. It's too easy to argue with a position I don't actually hold!

I'll repeat once again that I don't think it's funny that people are willingly ingesting toxic substances. I never even implied

toyot posted:

the people trying to heal themselves today are all rightwing scum who deserve their organ failure...
they're all qanon scum who weren't worth burdening a hospital worker for

That's something you created out of thin air, and I explicitly disavow this mentality. Everyone who is sick or wounded should be given medical attention without judgement.

Another thing you're making up is this idea that the people taking ivermectin, hydroxycloroquine, or whatever other quack fake "treatments" are sick desperate people who are grasping for any possibility of healing themselves, innocently hear of these supposed cures, and naively take them. The reality I'm trying to point out and you keep dodging in your replies is that there is a very clear direct link between these "treatments" and ultra right wing, fascistic settler ideology, specifically Qanon and related Trump era movements.

Nobody is taking ivermectin naively. As was pointed out above, regular distribution methods are now tightly controlled. People who seek out and successfully obtain this stuff aren't just doing it because they believe it's the best medical option for them, they're doing it because they've been indoctrinated into a highly reactionary system of beliefs. Once again, this does not mean that they are unworthy of help or compassion. But it's not meaningless either.

The first important consideration is who is susceptible to being indoctrinated into this system of beliefs? What is the class background that dominates and molds this ideology? It's the Trump voting labor aristocrat whitey. The other side of the white coin that cruelly laughs at them. It's not the most marginalized and vulnerable people in society; it's the failing "white working class" upset that a coherent covid response requires them to sacrifice something for the common good for the first time in their life. Do they deserve to suffer? No, I don't think anybody deserves to suffer, but the natural consequence of poisoning yourself is that you get poisoned. If the circumstances of your birth and background all led you into the Qanon cult and truly believing that the poison will heal you then that's absolutely tragic but the consequence remains the same. It's not a moral argument. If I had the power to change the whole sequence of events that led them to there of course I would but I don't because it would require liquidating the labor aristocracy as a class.

The second important thing is the content of this system of beliefs. Namely, the belief that the believers are the REAL oppressed minority. The belief that the coastal liberal elite making jokes at their expense and suppressing "the real cures" is tyranny. You are reproducing this reactionary ideology under the guise of a concern for the common person, and framing opposition to it as a moral failing. You're also discarding inconvenient material facts about the benefits of the vaccines, the dangers of the virus, and the responses of countries that were (at least relatively) successful in fighting the spread of COVID to try to reinforce this reactionary belief.


toyot posted:

you think the 'wellbeing of the collective' is best served by everyone being vaccinated

everyone who can be, yes, for the benefit of everyone else, including those who can't be vaccinated.

now, i know you included a bunch of qualifications immediately after that bit i quoted, and you may think it unfair of me to ignore them, but in my defence it was a stream of dog shit nonsense i'm not about to get down and roll around in with you. sorry to disappoint!

toyot please stop wrecking threads by trying to make them into the thread that got closed because of your bad posting
please give me thread monitor ty.
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you've got a nerve to call my character into question when you go around trotting out the supposedly monolithic opinions of your Black neighbours in support of your goddamn stupid arguments. go soak your head in a toilet bowl.
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what principle is that? privileging your own anecdotal understanding of pharmaceutical production over all scientific evidence? to what end exactly, protecting your own health, and all others be damned, even if they are unable to take social measures to guard against contagion?

lol at the idea that i've moved on with life as normal. you don't know the first thing about my life. you're completely full of shit, lashing out at others with a holier-than-thou attitude as a defensive mechanism, lest anyone discover your real life doesn't live up to this persona you project. maybe that plays well on twitter but i'm not buying it, buddy, and i sure as hell won't be complicit by coddling you and pretending your posts have any merit.
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toyot posted:

and i did wait for FDA approval, like i said, and got vaccinated right after it was approved. i successfully avoided covid for nearly two years, then got covid symptoms a few weeks after full vaccination.

this doesn't seem accurate to conversations we've had or even stuff you may have posted about before - I'm specifically talkng about you mentioning that it was likely you caught the rona early on in it's inception, you know the variant that the vaccine was built for? not the delta variant (or whatever other variant) that you probably got. btw, do you know what variant you got? no? then shut the fuck up.

just ifap toyo, its my own personal opinion that they are trolling you all but i dont really know why
Just a reminder to anyone who may be reading this exchange that the proletariat and allied revolutionary classes are defined by their labor, not their "labors" as toyot is using it here. Crafting skills, handiness, familiarity with tools, machines and industrial processes: these things are all great for any individual to have and pursue, but they don't necessarily lead to a more revolutionary consciousness and they shouldn't be bandied about as some kind of trump card over others. Tinkering with wood and electronics in your garage is a good hobby, not an integral part of the capitalist mode of production.

One of the great innovations of capitalism is precisely the deskilling of work. Capitalism took the task of commodity production away from the artisan classes, which can actually be associated with this "labors" concept, and gave it to the proletariat by breaking each complex production production process that an artisan would need to understand fully into simpler, self contained parts that workers could be trained on more quickly.

Through the social practice of production, the proletariat as a whole does accumulate the technical expertise necessary to run the society, and it's true that this expertise is an invaluable tool for revolution, but it should be seen as just one of the tools, not the primary aspect of the proletariat's revolutionary potential.

The revolutionary power of the proletariat doesn't come from the technical skill, knowledge, or achievements of each individual proletarian; it comes from the social role in production that the class as a whole plays. After all, the bourgeoisie, petty bourgeoisie, and lumpen can, and often do, train themselves in these skills but how skilled in their field an engineer or scientist is has nothing to do with how revolutionary they are. Labor is not merely an activity, it is a social relation. The position of the proletariat within this social relation is why they are revolutionary.
ive been busy sorry, hope everyone ok but considering 70 unread posts i will jump to the conclusion: no
breaking my fast to say that i got to hang out with forumsposter parenti yesterday and had a god damned blast.

writing an essay on the internet and i'll resurface and post it once i'm done.

see you in hell,
if anyone has recommendations regarding where a hobbyist could get / how to make a good growth medium for cyanobacteria macrocolonies please let me know

zhaoyao posted:

if anyone has recommendations regarding where a hobbyist could get / how to make a good growth medium for cyanobacteria macrocolonies please let me know

what sort of scale are you looking at? I have a biologist friend who's into that kind of stuff but I don't really have enough knowledge to know what to ask

well these fellers have a like 1 cm diameter colony right now and i just want to help them grow if i can bc i think they're cool. so very small scale

zhaoyao posted:

if anyone has recommendations regarding where a hobbyist could get / how to make a good growth medium for cyanobacteria macrocolonies please let me know

yeah, no problem, first select where you want your cyanobacteria to grown, then, and this is the tricky part, you're going to need a couple thousand hogs

got a talking to at work that i smell like weed too much

karphead posted:

got a talking to at work that i smell like weed too much


karphead posted:

got a talking to at work that i smell like weed too much

When I first started smoking weed coincided with the time I was also really heavily involved in taekwondo and every time I would go to practice after cheeching it up earlier I would get paranoid that I was somehow sweating/secreting a weed emulsion that everyone could smell

u were