Much like how run-of-the-mill nerds have fled the unsanitary physical world into the internet, My Little Pony, WoW and animé, so too are the academic hopefuls today hella eager to devote themselves to zizekian hodgepodge of social commentary based on irreverent anecdotes, film theory and lacan, and generally anything pomo and deconstructionist in favor of trying to consider solutions to localized, individual situations involving real human beings. There is a particular subject that feels, to me personally (imho, imho), hella overlooked: television. Another: babies, toddlers, children. Because of the former, the late capitalist world is more hostile, manipulative and alien place for the latter to grow up in. Moreso than anybody is willing to admit to themselves.

Most all households still have televisions and children grow up in front of them, while the content has steadily gotten more and more sophisticated in manipulating them. But this dilemma is no longer one that spawns discussion in the media, internet, academia, anywhere. Television is old news. And so as it is being overlooked, the blame on the arrested development of the western youth has no target. So the youth keep coming up with targets, using lacanian analysis and marxist theory to explain top-down the horrors of late capitalism, perhaps even intentionally distancing themselves as far as possible from the localized interaction they themselves were a part of years ago: the television and the toddler.

We've forgotten television. And who can blame us, what with how fast the internet grew. Who here is boring enough to still go on about the dangerous effects of television on our youth? Now it's all about the effects of social media, ultra-realistic video games, sexting, internet porn and all that good stuff. Who even has a television nowadays, man.

I would argue that what has been completely missed by the population at large is that television still exists as the primary medium that capitalism uses to reach small children and that the harmful effects of it are supremely underestimated.
There are many other facets of capitalism that were new, or at least rapidly evolving, during the war and after it, such as the fast food industry, coca-cola (u mustn't underestimate the incredible changes in western societies that soda pop alone has wrought), supermarkets, additives, rise of advertising and branding. These elements are now part of the past, their harmful effects on the psychology and physiology of children and adults universally accepted as a part of living in a modern society. Such effects are casually shrugged off as something one must simply teach their child to bear. As far as ads, television and branding go, most people deny any brainwashing takes place in the first place. And the academia shrugs and goes 'heh, sheeple will be sheeple'.

It is probably unwillingness to accept the contradiction. How can television still have control over me, it is a thing of the old world. There's youtube now, and internet forums. No way can such an antiquated piece of shit have a hold on me psychologically. It does not and never did.
I am not claiming these to be arguments that media and academia have made. They are the reasoning we, in our hurry, give ourselves so we wouldn't have to talk about television. Why would you want to, when what you know is the internet and Zizek. Where your strengths and interests lie, there you will seek to shine the spotlight and call to people 'let's find out more about this here, btw I'm an expert and my fees are very reasonable'
But if you force yourself to think on the old, forgotten television, the reality of the situation is clear. We are more vulnerable the younger we are and when we were at our most vulnerable, during the first three or four years of our lives, everything else paled to the effect of the television. The light, the sound, the fast pace, the cuts, the people, the colors, the volume, the products, the cartoons, the music, the hypnosis and, of course, as the opposite, the numb reality we had to return to eventually. Nothing compared then, nothing compares now. Nothing except video games. But those are for later years. It's fair to say that during the first three years of our life at least, television is king. And by the time any other medium has a chance to challenge it, it has already been accepted into the fabric of reality as a natural, unchanging constant.

Television is now not something brought into the household, it is not an artifact discussed, examined, taught about. Television is simply there, always. It's there from the moment you first eye your surroundings while going hog wild on your mothers teat in the living room. Television is the air you breathe and with it come the ads.

Ads and children. This is the interaction that sculpts us more than we'd like to think.

A child cannot discern the nature of an advertisement in any shape or form. It does not understand where the ad comes from, why its there in his or her home. The child does not understand why it is necessary for the network to air adverts, receiving ad revenue in exchange to fund the cartoons the kid loves. The child does not understand that the man telling you about the new product line isn't doing it out of goodwill. To a small child the ad man's unbridled enthusiasm about a particular brand of dish washing liquid comes off genuine. To a child the only reason the ad man could be so excited is the unforeseen awesomeness of the product. The child receives a simple message: this is a thing worth getting more excited over than anybody you've ever met has ever been. The child understands the message at the shallowest level possible: product good. So good we had to come into your living room and tell you directly. It's brainwashing at its most basic, plain and simple. Later on in life the child grows up and doubts that he or she was ever manipulated. After all, they've grown up and learned the art of cynicism. Even if they were successfully manipulated in your early childhood, surely the damage was minor and in the long run without consequence. No way could my psyche be damaged irrevocably by something as benign as television advertising. This is the reasoning people, who spent their childhood in front of a television, go through to arrive at the decision to not deny their children television for their first years. To keep television away until the kids will have grown old enough to be able to discuss it's characteristics. I'd say it's obvious that the damage is not minor, it doesn't go away by itself and as it affect the vast majority of the population of every western country, the accumulated harm is innumerable.

I want to paint a picture of an oft downplayed horror in the life of a western adolescent at the age of two or three or something. I dunno, could be four or five or six. Here I'm writing about babies and know shit about em. Anyway the horror: the supermarket. Imagine yourself a child (or use a mirror aha). Before your eyes lie the endless spoils of capitalism, toy aisles unending, sugary goods in colorful packages under lighting so strong you can make out every detail and fine print. Compared to your dark damp murky moldy cavelike apartment your parents covered in furniture in faded cream and beige, everything looks so clear, colorful, crisp and lifelike; it's as if every product on display jumped out from the glowing backlit screen of a television set and walked onto the shelves. This is it. This is where you'd end up if you could jump inside the television. It's so beautiful. And never-ending. You can't even see up to the highest shelves. Should you let go of your moms hand, a little pee would come out and tears would follow. How helpless you, how vast the supermarket. A sea of everything you want. And not only what you want. More. You don't even recognize half of the things on display. Every other package introduces a product you didn't even know you wanted. But it's all variations on a theme. Look here, you haven't seen ads of these products before but you can tell that they could have their own ads on the tube anyday now. The packages all have similar style when compared to their neighbors on the shelves. They all have brands. And brands cannot live without advertising. That must be it. You've simply missed their ads. More the reason to have it, to try out a brand you haven't even seen ads about. What a thrill. And look at the amount of brands and things. The games, the appliances, the clothes, the bikes, the televisions, my god the size of the televisions. And the food, the candy, the soda, the types of bread, burgers, pizzas, ice cream, yoghurt, cold cuts, juices, on and on and on. There's so much of everything it's blowing your fragile little mind: so many brands and each brand more colorful and stylish than the one before it.

It's no longer a daydream or an analogy. You have stepped inside the television. The ads were right, they were all right. The people were smiling for a reason. This is why the man in the ad was yelling, this is why everybody was jumping up and down at the thought of getting whatever the man was selling.

And no way is all this the work of a man. Look at the size of this place. Who could alone build a store this big, who could alone keep these endless shelves stocked with products. Who could give life to cartoons, make these plastic figures and electronic gadgets with no uses discernible to you. It's better not to even think about it. Maybe this is what everybody else's life is all about. There's hella families here isn't there? Maybe everybody else lives here. I dunno.

Maybe it's the sugar from the candy your mom always gives you for the car ride here to keep you quiet, but there's no denying the reality of the situation. You're somewhere better than your own life in every way.

Every wish fulfilled, all wants met, this is the grea-

We're leaving already? But the cart isn't even halfway full. Look, that family has two full carts and the kid even gets their own to push around. This can't be right. You don't mean to say you brought me here to smell all these boxes, to press the PUSH ME's, to fly from one daydream to the next, which I, a child, by the way, can't discern from reality too well anyway, to hug the huge elmos, to read the descriptions of all the board games, to spell out the entirety of the disney dvd aisle, to greet all the kellogg's animals and dream about the time it would take me to drink through all those coke bottles on display, and the end result is that were going home with just groceries. Why aren't we taking more. They're right there. You can just pick them up, there's plenty room in the cart. I can tell you what we need, I saw some cool shit on the television. Hey. It's not funny. Look at this shit, it's right there. You can just pick it up, look. Look. Look. I just picked it up, I'll put it in the cart. That's it. Simple. Why can't we do that. What the fuck. C'mon. Don't you understand how easy it is. You can just take them. Just Fucking take more stuff you whore. You fucking bitch. Why do you have to make this so hard. I can't take this. We're in Narnia. We're in the freaking middle-earth. This is fucking sesame street. We can't just go back to the real world without taking something with. I'm gonna have a panic attack. Oh jesus. Oh god. I don't get it. Why would you do this to your own kid. We could. Just. Take. The. Stuff. It's right there. Fuck. Do you really think I'm going to forget about this? You really think I'm going
to forgive you?

Teaching critical thinking at college level is too late. Writing books about capitalist realism is too little. All rhetoric is powerless. Indoctrination starts at the cradle and sinks so deep into the depths of the unconscious that it will never see natural light.

What a perfect boner the we're committing. Just try and tell people to give up television for the first few years you have a little kid the house. That's not gonna happen. Don't tell me how to raise my kids. I need my soaps. They'll grow up weird if they don't know what American Idol is by age four.

Destroy television. You personally have propably made the logical leap from 'im no longer thinking about television at all and nobodys talking about it, its all Facebook this and twitter that now. Television barely exists in my life anymore dude.' to 'theres no reason to get riled up over television anymore.' There's plenty reason. More reasons are born every day. And they're most born into the poor families, the ones most vulnerable, most likely to stay in front of television.
What kind of anti-television films do you remember? Cable guy? That's it? It's all always played out irreverently, maybe a minor character acts weird because their parents were never home and they grew up watching too much leno. It's never portrayed as a fundamental piece in disturbing the psyche of everybody involved. It should be. But we're in denial. It's hard to get riled up.

Shit is fucked man. We do not dream of a just society. We dream of nothing, because the only thing we want to dream of has been sealed off as unnatural, monstrous gunshot wound of a thought shot into us by the omnipotent artifact we now pity as the major relic of the impotent, naive past. We won't allow ourselves to dream of it, not ever. And so our dream will never go filled.

The only thing we can and want to dream of, really and honestly as the children we are to our graves, is a happy meal.

Discussion of KIDS <3 ADS on tHE r H i z z o n E:

i like this a lot but i don't really see where to go from here. i mean especially as you mention poor kids being most likely to be subjected to this (because of parents working etc) so it seems like we have to unfuck ourselves in order to combat television as a medium but in order to unfuck ourselves we have to first stop the continuous indoctrination of children through television? What Is To Be Done

clanzy posted:

ty m8. me theology teach in hs told us that thinkin about evil deeds was considered to be half-way into committing a sin and so, in itself a deplorable act and an insult to God. So thinking and reading about the subject would prolly be a fine start. academics could just write papers on the subject and mebbe even studies. demonstrating more links between adult-age disfunction and TV in would prolly go well. straight up talking to friends who are about to have babby would b cool, though there youd have to first make sure you can make your point in a way that dosent come off nagging or so. makin big waves in society is beyond most everbody duh so little things is wot you got to go with. maybe someone oughta write an approachable book or make a documentary on it like that guy wit hte sideburns or the fat guy with a cap.

o yea u could try n convince all ur frnds 2 exchange tv for netflix or other ad-free platforms.

edit; as far as politics go, focusing on education is hella more important, when talkin bout poors. so as far as they go, what is to be done is put monny in2 schoolz. so the poor kids can grow to form households that can afford to replace tv with netflix

Edited by Fucker ()

good stuff fucker. my only suggestion is use some text formatting next time beCause It'scOol.
i dont think i buy that as a systematic solution. like unless society is seriously restructured there will always be households that can't afford to dismember and de-advertise tv with netflix, and even then in the interim we have this whole new generation of people that have been indoctrinated. idk. it's complicated and hard. death to videodrome

good Post.

what this reminded me of is -- to take a Wild Swing of a guess as to what the "man behind the screen" really has up his sleeve -- malnutrition. yes toys. yes board games and shit. but nothing gets shat into babby's brains more than foodstuffs. and they're all poison.. i think there's a way to heal/mentally decolonize Ads with a little bit of patience and a lot of nutrients. which is exactly what that lunchables shit prevents from happening. but then again this isn't news, and maybe you're onto something when you point hte finger at the television when Mom & Pop are reading the newspaper scratching their Ad-victim naive heads wondering what makes kids want to eat pizza for breakfast.

Edited by parabolart ()


Fucker posted:

same op
i'd go further than this does. the only way to defend oneself from marketing it to avoid it, and to some degree you never can. that inner child remains susceptible and anyone who denies that kids themselves. great rhetoric tho! i give Fucker two thumbs up
hey fucker are you familiar with any media literacy stuff? most of it's focused on pedagogy instead of theory but it addresses what you're getting at specifically
Let me tell you

That was one hell of a post
Children have to be socialized with ethics and values somehow, are you going to do it? Television performs this role and i'm sick of libertarian types decrying it's supposedly antiquated version of 'morality' in favour of atomized internet nihilism.

We've already lost so much cultural memory and community spirit in the unions and churches, please don't let it happen again.
I grew up without tv in the house and became an illiterate autist regardless. Plus now I'm extremely bad at remembering the 90s.
lol you didn't read the OP did you
Good article though. Pretty sure the only real solution here is seizing control of the media and broadcasting wrestlemania to the people without the encroachment of parasitical advertising firms.
attn: creative class


littlegreenpills posted:

lol you didn't read the OP did you


[account deactivated]
boo fucking hoo OP
what the fuck is this, adbusters?
[account deactivated]

Several European countries forbid or severely curtail advertising to children; in the United States, on the other hand, selling to children is simply “business as usual.”1 The average young person views more than 3000 ads per day on television (TV), on the Internet, on billboards, and in magazines.2 Increasingly, advertisers are targeting younger and younger children in an effort to establish “brand-name preference” at as early an age as possible.3 This targeting occurs because advertising is a $250 billion/year industry with 900 000 brands to sell,2 and children and adolescents are attractive consumers: teenagers spend $155 billion/year, children younger than 12 years spend another $25 billion, and both groups influence perhaps another $200 billion of their parents' spending per year.4,5 Increasingly, advertisers are seeking to find new and creative ways of targeting young consumers via the Internet, in schools, and even in bathroom stalls.1

Research has shown that young children—younger than 8 years—are cognitively and psychologically defenseless against advertising.6–9 They do not understand the notion of intent to sell and frequently accept advertising claims at face value.10 In fact, in the late 1970s, the Federal Trade Commission (FTC) held hearings, reviewed the existing research, and came to the conclusion that it was unfair and deceptive to advertise to children younger than 6 years.11 What kept the FTC from banning such ads was that it was thought to be impractical to implement such a ban.11 However, some Western countries have done exactly that: Sweden and Norway forbid all advertising directed at children younger than 12 years, Greece bans toy advertising until after 10 PM, and Denmark and Belgium severely restrict advertising aimed at children.12

Children and adolescents view 400 00 ads per year on TV alone.13 This occurs despite the fact that the Children's Television Act of 1990 (Pub L No. 101–437) limits advertising on children's programming to 10.5 minutes/hour on weekends and 12 minutes/hour on weekdays. However, much of children's viewing occurs during prime time, which features nearly 16 minutes/hour of advertising.14 A 30-second ad during the Super Bowl now costs $2.3 million but reaches 80 million people.15
what happened to BlinkandWeezerFan? disciple u gotta front page fuckres post
By explicitly tying advertising to childhood obesity, the government is suggesting there is a darker side to cuddly figures like Cap’n Crunch, the Keebler elves, Ronald McDonald and the movie and television characters used to promote food. It also raises the question of whether they might ultimately share the fate of Joe Camel, the cartoon figure used to promote Camel cigarettes that was phased out amid allegations that it was meant to entice children to smoke.

But according to the Rudd Center, from 2008 to 2011, total media spending to promote child-targeted cereals increased by 34 percent. And though companies did improve the nutritional quality of most cereals marketed to children, they also increased child-targeted advertising for some of their least nutritious products, including Reese’s Puffs, Fruit Loops and Pebbles.

What’s more, companies continue to aggressively market their least nutritious products directly to children, the Rudd Center found. The more nutritious and lower-sugar cereals like regular Cheerios and Frosted Mini-Wheats, were marketed to parents, not children.

As for the FTC, it is revising a 2008 report that looked at how food companies market their products to children, and what effects it has on childhood obesity, based on data from 2006.

The new report, which is scheduled to be released by the end of 2012, will examine 2009 data that the FTC subpoenaed from more than 40 companies.

This is a considerable step after Congress last year shot down the recommendations of an interagency working group composed of the FTC, the Food and Drug Administration, the Centers for Disease Control and Prevention, and the U.S. Department of Agriculture, which had been formed in 2009. The group, which was led by former U.S. Sens. Sam Brownback and Tom Harkin, had been tasked with developing recommendations for the nutritional quality of food marketed to kids ages 2 to 17. They came out with a set of proposed voluntary principles that could be used by the food industry, and testified before Congress in October.

But it went nowhere. “Congress was concerned that the proposal was too strict and unrealistic and it would be too difficult for the companies to abide by those guidelines,” said Mary Engle, associate director for advertising practices for the FTC, in Washington, D.C.

“Food advertisers and the advertising industry in general made it very clear they were opposed to the guidelines. We received hundreds of letters from members of congress, indicating that they thought the interagency working group should not finalize those proposed guidelines.”

So the working group essentially dismantled, and its final guidelines were never released.
the ops puplisheable now with proper pix

clanzy posted:

totes changin the pics to videodrome stills. i agree on me comin up short on a systematic solution. that'd take actual research

parabolart posted:

yeas! nutrition is a huge ass issue. i pretty much think that ou cant reason with advertising and that even in perfect health you're brains going to get fucked with unless you put immense time into meditation or some such. Bad nutrition in the states imo is more of a thing that completely robs kids of energy to learn or think critically. its prolly a bigger problem than tv even.but especially as a combo theyre both likely a way bigger problem than anybody's willing to admit publically.

peepaw posted:

from what i understand, media literacy concerns teaching middle-schoolers and older, at which point i think most all of the damage will have been done. That's the thing, television alone is an insanely complex system with its own memes by the boatload and explaining the intricacies of its various subsystems like genres of programs,sitcoms with laugh tracks, manipulation of emotions through musical cues in film, demographics et cetera, is impossible. A toddler will soak all that in and who knows what they make of it.

Ironicwarcriminal posted:

aghreed, lets dismantle television as it stands and build up in its place only local tv networks that have real local personalities communicating with the community in a way that isn't exploitative. a communist television mite b cool

slothrap posted:


ilmdge posted:

shits gnarly man, cool stats

do you have a blog?
what's with the nietzschean conclusion??
what happened? here's the proper pics

shit cant find the one of francine
nice op. struck me because i recently added childhood friend on facebook who was about as close to being Raised By TV as possible. i remember my parents even talking about it in disapproving tones when i was a kid. like 75% of his status updates are live blogging whatever big TV event is on. its really funny because he's being "bitchy" and "cynical" but only in this tv friendly way, like he's the bad guy on american idol or something. it's really sassy and bizarre and all his slams are only slams in that they refer to some other comparable TV show, advvertisement or rock'n'roll icon or whatever. and the DENSITY of it; in his last 8 status updates he's managed to fit in comments about 16 separate TV shows, commercials, celebrities, musicians (appearing on tv), and even one reference to a TV guide. kind of depressing. anyway, i was having a good chuckle about it until i read this thread lol
This might sound like 60s bullshit but I'm convinced this is the underlying reason that THC and LSD are forbidden. They are some of the only safe/effective drugs that have the ability to return the consciousness to an oceanic state and potentially de-program an adult mind.
what's to stop the producers of Sesame Street doing a skit on the fact that advertisers lie in order to get you to buy their products? this is my gay as hell personal experience, but my parents sat me down and explained it to me at the age of 5, and after a short while I understood it pretty well. it quietened me down in the supermarket. people who make a living out of explaining things to children ought to be able to do a better job surely

ilmdge posted:

what happened? here's the proper pics

shit cant find the one of francine

it was DW not francine u IDIOT


NounsareVerbs posted:

This might sound like 60s bullshit but I'm convinced this is the underlying reason that THC and LSD are forbidden. They are some of the only safe/effective drugs that have the ability to return the consciousness to an oceanic state and potentially de-program an adult mind.

if that were true pretty much everyone would be "deprogrammed" by now lol

You know what's great when you're high? No-effort to prepare, processed foods with shitloads of salt and sugar in it.

NounsareVerbs posted:

This might sound like 60s bullshit but I'm convinced this is the underlying reason that THC and LSD are forbidden. They are some of the only safe/effective drugs that have the ability to return the consciousness to an oceanic state and potentially de-program an adult mind.

reptilians did 9/11 must be the deprogrammed truth then

the big thing now is for adults to take tv shows seriously as a form of intellectual engagement. i'm not sure if this has ever been the case before the past decade. now you spend hours, days, weeks of your lives watching mad men, the wire etc. just for basic cultural literacy. when you look at the volumes of critical writing produced by girls or game of thrones, you can see the weight of this pose threatening to collapse in on itself.
yeah the liberal farts are bullshit

KilledInADuel posted:

the big thing now is for adults to take tv shows seriously as a form of intellectual engagement. i'm not sure if this has ever been the case before the past decade. now you spend hours, days, weeks of your lives watching mad men, the wire etc. just for basic cultural literacy. when you look at the volumes of critical writing produced by girls or game of thrones, you can see the weight of this pose threatening to collapse in on itself.

at least no one is watching this shit live tho

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