#1
Nippon
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feel free 2 add

1. Women have the ability to have an abortion or give the baby up for adoption in the event of an accidental pregnancy, without the consent of the father. This is not a subject of criticism; it is the woman's body and therefore her decision. The man, however, has no recourse for an accidental pregnancy. By law, he must pay child support under threat of unemployability and imprisonment, even if he stated ahead of time that he had no intention of having a baby or even any real relationship with the mother. Roughly 20% of his net income for about 20 years must be paid without his prior consent, for commuting no crime.

Goethestein was probated until (Jan. 9, 2012 23:51:09) for this post!

#2
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counter point: wrap up your junk
#3
Nippon
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one should certainly be responsible and wrap ones' junk, especially in casual encounters. but there are two problems with this logic. the first is the question if one would respond to a woman suffering the consequences of unwanted pregnancy with such a flippant response. second, if one is in a committed relationship and the girlfriend suggests to stop using condoms because of female birth control, the father is still fully on the hook for the consequences, regardless of any incompetence, misstatements or lapses on her part.
#4
penitent
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im a masculinist. men own, being male owns, men should ally themselves with womens struggle
#5
penitent
Post rating: +
patriarchy hurts women more than men but its still psychologically damaging for us. men should combat patriarchy alongside but not within the feminist movement. because patriarchy dominates our presence would be a corrupting one. instead we must reclaim our masculinity from capital's emasculating influence, cast aside the grotesque caricature of masculinism promoted by capitalism, become new men, and meet with our sisters on the sunlit slopes of a new society. imo
#6
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Goethestein posted:



welp that's just the risk you take enter in a relationship with someone

#7
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why not start with something a bit more practical like custody rights?
#8
Nippon
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Hurricane_Faggot posted:

Goethestein posted:

welp that's just the risk you take enter in a relationship with someone



,slut

#9
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what other choice do i have as a man other than completely accept the consequence of my actions? as far as i'm concerned, the choice of whether or not to have a kid stops as soon as the woman i'm with finds out she's pregnant. she needs to figure what's best for her and my emotions toward it are not important.

Edited by Hurricane_Faggot ()

#10
tardy on these heaters
Post rating: ~
this thread is now about silvia federici:

1486: publication of the Malleus Maleficarum; 1492: Columbus occupies Americas. These are the dates that signal the culmination of the crisis of the feudal world, as a result of long peasants' struggles, and the artisan workers' demand for independence from merchants. Serfdom was coming to an end, despite the sustained attempt of rulers to regain power. Globalisation began when the European elites annexed America to Europe. With the rise of Protestantism, begging starts being seen as a sin and becomes criminalised.

In the 16th and 17th century population starts being treated as an instrument of wealth creation; this changes the general attitude to procreation and fatality.

A) One explanation for the witch hunt is the attempt to take over the body of women in order to control the source of labour. Like the slave trade, the witch hunt became a means to control women, to the extent of criminalizing reproductive autonomy. The economic utility of procreation demanded the establishment of direct control over the reproductive process. The severity of punishment of infanticide arose in the same period, as did capital punishment for abortion. The witch hunt was instrumental to the appropriation of women's bodies for the reproduction of the worker. This continues up to our day. Even now, the state is fighting to control the production of life, evidently in the boom of reproductive technologies and attempts to make reproduction independent from women's bodies.

B) The development of new work discipline and the intensification of labour - despite technology, we now work more than ever - begins in the same period as the witch hunt. The elite looks into all aspects of life (festivals, community activities) as something to be eliminated as superfluous. An attack is waged on all forms of sexuality that is 'unproductive'. The demonisation of female sexuality went hand in hand with the new work discipline.

C) The process whereby the work that goes into the reproduction of life is devalued. Every activity that is useful to the reproduction of the capacity to work is declared as non-work. With capitalism all reproductive activity became feminised, and women become expelled from wage labour. Women's labour disappears as work. The division of labour is the basis of a hierarchy o labour along gender lines, and wage is the tool of separation. The violence that characterised the relation between men and women is embedded in this disparity. The ideology of the witch hunt says that there is something wrong with women who have money, in fact the most commonly persecuted figure is the prostitute. Witch hunt per se did not cause this devaluation of reproduction; that was rather the product of a restructuring of capitalism. Nonetheless, witch hunt was necessary to discipline women into this new role, to create new functions and identities. These have naturalised women's exploitation, hiding it and making it appear as something of nature.

The roots of sexism and racism are the same: a situation where you need workers without rights. Enslavement is essential to this process of accumulation and these have not been one time events; these developments became structural to capitalist society. In the last twenty years you can see similar developments. A globalisation based on land expropriation, migration, an increase in the impoverishment of women, mass prostitution, baby markets etc. As a result of present globalising drives, there has been an explosion of violence against women. Over the last fifteen years there has been a return to witch hunting, in Ghana for instance. The redefinition of the social position of women turns the woman into a kind of compensation for the man's loss of power. The woman is a new common, seen as the new nature, like water etc, something everyone can go and get.

The way sexuality is used, the sex industry has been restructured to define aa relationship between men and the female body which is violent.

#11
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deadken posted:
patriarchy hurts women more than men but its still psychologically damaging for us. men should combat patriarchy alongside but not within the feminist movement. because patriarchy dominates our presence would be a corrupting one. instead we must reclaim our masculinity from capital's emasculating influence, cast aside the grotesque caricature of masculinism promoted by capitalism, become new men, and meet with our sisters on the sunlit slopes of a new society. imo


this but unironically

The Men's Right Movement (if you couldn't tell) is comprised of some unsavory characters wrt equality/egalitarianism, despite their protests of being the true defenders of equal rights. An example from the Spearhead: "feminism causes violence against women"

#12
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I am taking the op seriously

sorry
#13
tardy on these heaters
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jettojagga posted:
I am taking the op seriously

sorry



you should read caliban and the witch instead

#14
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cool, should make a good companion w/From Hell~
#15
penitent
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jettojagga posted:
this but unironically



i wasnt being ironic

#16
Nippon
Post rating: ~
2. The huge disparities in on-the-job accidents (2 to 1) on-the-job deaths (10 to 1) suicide rates (4 to 1) murder rates (3 to 1) imprisonment rates (9 to 1) and deaths from military service (50 to 1.)
#17
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how was my post misogynist when it referring to another man taking up his end in the relationship?
#18
San Francisco
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If a woman chooses not to have sex, she is considered virtuous, whereas if a man chooses not to have sex, he is mocked and derided.
#19
Post rating: +

lungfish posted:
If a woman chooses not to have sex, she is considered virtuous, whereas if a man chooses not to have sex, he is mocked and derided.



we all have our cross to bear

#20
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Tsargon posted:

lungfish posted:
If a woman chooses not to have sex, she is considered virtuous, whereas if a man chooses not to have sex, he is mocked and derided.

we all have our cross to bear



lmao

#21
Unapologetic Opponent of Rape
Post rating: ~
If a man is a victim of domestic violence, he is emasculated and denigrated by his peers, who would never do the same if the sexes were reversed. Non-reciprocal violence by partners is in fact most commonly committed by the female partner.

An increasingly large amount of the male population is subject to rape, including female-on-male rape, yet this is systematically undermined and laughed at. Our media often assumes a state of "automatic consent" for men - even when consent is explicitly not given - and men are taught to think that being raped is "cool" or "sexy." Stories often include high levels of implied rape or explicit rape of men that goes unnoticed because the victim is a man and the perpetrator is a woman. Far higher acceptance of rape myths occurs in these situations.
#22
Nippon
Post rating: ~
That is a good point cycloneboy. For all the talk feminists make of this being a "rape culture" because jokes are made about rape in the mass media, I cannot think of a single instance in any television show, movie or other format in which the rape victim offered up for laughs was not male.
#23
Nippon
Post rating: ~

Hurricane_Faggot posted:
what other choice do i have as a man other than completely accept the consequence of my actions? as far as i'm concerned, the choice of whether or not to have a kid stops as soon as the woman i'm with finds out she's pregnant. she needs to figure what's best for her and my emotions toward it are not important.



The choice of whether or not to have the child is certainly up to the woman, as it should be. The father should however be able to deny child support payments prior to the child's birth, especially in the absence of any prior serious relationship with the mother or evidence of misstatements or lapses on her part on the subject of using birth control.

#24
Nippon
Post rating: ~

Hurricane_Faggot posted:
how was my post misogynist when it referring to another man taking up his end in the relationship?



The point was that your logic was perfectly identical to that of people arguing against pro-choice positions. "You don't want that baby? Too bad, that's the risk you take."

#25
mt.real
Post rating: ~

deadken posted:
patriarchy hurts women more than men but its still psychologically damaging for us. men should combat patriarchy alongside but not within the feminist movement. because patriarchy dominates our presence would be a corrupting one. instead we must reclaim our masculinity from capital's emasculating influence, cast aside the grotesque caricature of masculinism promoted by capitalism, become new men, and meet with our sisters on the sunlit slopes of a new society. imo



i'm down w/this post

however

my sister has a daughter and doesn't know who the father is, i was told (long ago) it was some one night stand and she doesn't know, but now he will never know and neither will her daughter and that's a little weird to me. my sister made like zero effort to look as far as i know.

also a girl i dated for a long time had a miscarriage (long before we hooked up) and never told the guy, first when she was pregnant, and then definitely not after she miscarried. i feel like he ought to know. i mean i know, and i had nothing to do with it. i am under the impression this sort of thing happens a lot.

i don't think pregnancies should be considered 100% a thing that concerns solely the mother. it's like 99.99999% but i believe one should at least get to know.

#26
Unapologetic Opponent of Rape
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the real problem with all this stuff wrt men and their biological children is that fatherhood ain't a genetic condition.
#27
[account deactivated]
#28
Nippon
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yes indeedy what a consequence free life living on the road, being unable to hold legal employment, and facing harassing phone calls, family separation, private investigators, police and prison time
#29
Nippon
Post rating: ~
even if your state or nation bans abortion you can be like all the other filthy murdering whores and pay some med student in a veterinarian's office drug money to stick a tattoo pen into your womb after hours and go about without living with the consequences of your actions

Goethestein was probated until (Oct. 6, 2011 06:08:38) for this post!

#30
Unapologetic Opponent of Rape
Post rating: ~
durr this child shares a slightly-higher-than-average quantity of genetic code with you, you must now pay loads of cash. this is because you are the "father," which is in turn because I am western scum and Biology Is God
#31
[account deactivated]
#32
[account deactivated]
#33
Post rating: ~

Goethestein posted:

That is a good point cycloneboy. For all the talk feminists make of this being a "rape culture" because jokes are made about rape in the mass media, I cannot think of a single instance in any television show, movie or other format in which the rape victim offered up for laughs was not male.





#34
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please do not interpret that post as any level of implicit acceptance of all the other vile shit y'all been spewing in this thread
#35
Unapologetic Opponent of Rape
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a dude has sex with a woman one time, and by mutual consent does not wear a condom because she's on the pill. except, actually, she is not on the pill, and gets pregnant and now he has to pay out the ass for a kid. please justify this without appealing to biology-as-God.
#36
[account deactivated]
#37
penitent
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Cycloneboy posted:
a dude has sex with a woman one time, and by mutual consent does not wear a condom because she's on the pill. except, actually, she is not on the pill, and gets pregnant and now he has to pay out the ass for a kid. please justify this without appealing to biology-as-God.



why do you care about this at all given that its never going to affect your weird beadborken lil life

#38
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#39
Unapologetic Opponent of Rape
Post rating: ~

deadken posted:
why do you care about this at all given that its never going to affect your weird beadborken lil life

why should you care about anything, if it doesn't make a difference in your life. - a socialist

discipline posted:
women make 70 cents on the dollar kiddo

so give her like, tax dollars, from all men.

#40
[account deactivated]