#1
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#2
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discipline posted:
Khan, a member of AQAP, co-edited the group’s slick English-language Internet magazine, Inspire, which was intended to recruit Westerners to al-Qaeda’s fold. Aulaqi was also believed to have played a role in creating the online-only magazine, whose first issue in July 2010 included an article titled “Making a bomb in the kitchen of your mom.” Khan, a Saudi-born U.S. citizen raised in Queens, N.Y., and Charlotte, traveled to Yemen to join AQAP and likely operated under Aulaqi’s direction, terrorism experts have said.


not trying to be a guy who says us constitutional law is the alpha and omega of what is good and bad but

SCOTUS posted:
The Act punishes persons who "advocate or teach the duty, necessity, or propriety" of violence "as a means of accomplishing industrial or political reform"; or who publish or circulate or display any book or paper containing such advocacy; or who "justify" the commission of violent acts "with intent to exemplify, spread or advocate the propriety of the doctrines of criminal syndicalism"; or who "voluntarily assemble" with a group formed "to teach or advocate the doctrines of criminal syndicalism."

Neither the indictment nor the trial judge's instructions to the jury in any way refined the statute's bald definition of the crime in terms of mere advocacy not distinguished from incitement to imminent lawless action. Accordingly, we are here confronted with a statute which, by its own words and as applied, purports to punish mere advocacy and to forbid, on pain of criminal punishment, assembly with others merely to advocate the described type of action. Such a statute falls within the condemnation of the First and Fourteenth Amendments.

#3
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#4
Mike Nelson here.
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i don't have a problem with this.
#5
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i'm feelin that spirit of '69
#6
tardy on these heaters
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xipe posted:
i'm feelin that spirit of '69



are you seriously comparing awlaki to fred hampton

#7
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babyfinland posted:

xipe posted:
i'm feelin that spirit of '69

are you seriously comparing awlaki to fred hampton



i was considering more the actions of the us federal gov, but yes they were both anti-american extremists

#8
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#9
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i wish i was on the world newsdesk at work so i could describe terrorist/insurgent attacks as "extrajudicial executions"
#10
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#11
Mike Nelson here.
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Imagine some guy, call him Heinrich Traitor, decides to work for the Nazis. So he gets into Germany and eventually works his way up to helping Hitler himself. So him and Hitler are taking a convoy ride to a secret lair. Allied intelligence picks up on this and decides to bomb the convoy. "Wait!" Discipline appears from a electrical storm, having time traveled to prevent the attack. "It would be an extrajudicial execution! You gotta arrest Heinrich Traitor under US law! Don't kill Hitler!" I rest my case. Case closed.
#12
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two problems with that:
- i've never seen anything besides the vaguest of allegations that al-Aulaqi did anything besides give sermons saying attacks on americans/westerners are justified, which depending on your definition of "imminent" is protected speech
- the problem you described was never an issue in the past b/c americans who went over to teh enemy had their citizenship stripped via a legal adjudication. obama could have done that, but didn't (prolly because he didn't have any evidence that wasn't obtained under torture)
#13
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getfiscal posted:
Imagine some guy, call him Heinrich Traitor, decides to work for the Nazis. So he gets into Germany and eventually works his way up to helping Hitler himself. So him and Hitler are taking a convoy ride to a secret lair. Allied intelligence picks up on this and decides to bomb the convoy. "Wait!" Discipline appears from a electrical storm, having time traveled to prevent the attack. "It would be an extrajudicial execution! You gotta arrest Heinrich Traitor under US law! Don't kill Hitler!" I rest my case. Case closed.



are you saying muslims are nazis?

cause that makes perfect sense imo.

#14
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oh and nazi germany posed an actual existential threat to something other than american occupations and cheap oil
#15
Mike Nelson here.
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thirdplace posted:
two problems with that:
- i've never seen anything besides the vaguest of allegations that al-Aulaqi did anything besides give sermons saying attacks on americans/westerners are justified, which depending on your definition of "imminent" is protected speech
- the problem you described was never an issue in the past b/c americans who went over to teh enemy had their citizenship stripped via a legal adjudication. obama could have done that, but didn't (prolly because he didn't have any evidence that wasn't obtained under torture)

actually my scenario works just as well if the guy was innocent. you've got a chance to kill hitler, do you not do it because he's talking to an american pow at the same time?

#16
Mike Nelson here.
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thirdplace posted:
oh and nazi germany posed an actual existential threat to something other than american occupations and cheap oil

they both pose a threat to DEMOCRACY bub

#17
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getfiscal posted:
thirdplace posted:
two problems with that:
- i've never seen anything besides the vaguest of allegations that al-Aulaqi did anything besides give sermons saying attacks on americans/westerners are justified, which depending on your definition of "imminent" is protected speech
- the problem you described was never an issue in the past b/c americans who went over to teh enemy had their citizenship stripped via a legal adjudication. obama could have done that, but didn't (prolly because he didn't have any evidence that wasn't obtained under torture)

actually my scenario works just as well if the guy was innocent. you've got a chance to kill hitler, do you not do it because he's talking to an american pow at the same time?



but what if WHAT IF he also knew the location of a nuclear bomb that was going to explode in an hour WHAT THEN

#18
Mike Nelson here.
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holy shit is a nuke going off in an hour?
#19
tardy on these heaters
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getfiscal posted:
holy shit is a nuke going off in an hour?



getfiscal ate some hot wings. yes.

#20
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#21
San Francisco
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The poor terrorists.
#22
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lungfish posted:
The poor terrorists.

they can assassinate a US citizen, openly, without any legal oversight, whicfh is exactly what i'm gonna do to you

#23
San Francisco
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Crow posted:

lungfish posted:
The poor terrorists.

they can assassinate a US citizen, openly, without any legal oversight, whicfh is exactly what i'm gonna do to you


Cool death threat. Mods?

#24
tardy on these heaters
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lungfish posted:

Crow posted:

lungfish posted:
The poor terrorists.

they can assassinate a US citizen, openly, without any legal oversight, whicfh is exactly what i'm gonna do to you

Cool death threat. Mods?



Shocking, but true.

#25
San Francisco
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They expand the drone strikes to terrorist sympathizers.
#26
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#27
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right now i am watching footage of obama giving the keynote address at the annual dinner of the Human Rights Campaign

jesus christ

e: i mean i know they're an LGBT lobby, but with a name like that you'd think he'd show a little discretion
#28
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#29
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#30
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life for the people who make these drones appears to be cynical/unthinking enough to imitate art



#31
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#32
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what did awlaki do again
#33
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#34
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ehhe thats pretty f*cked up. i wrote in my book to destroy a lot of things, including us government, and also celebrating islam. i hope they bomb me
#35
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#36
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i use so much irony that it's tempting to think of it that way, but it's not i guess. i was going to write an article for here called "against irony" or something like that, but i can't get myself to sit down and write a damn essay
#37
tardy on these heaters
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Impper posted:
i use so much irony that it's tempting to think of it that way, but it's not i guess. i was going to write an article for here called "against irony" or something like that, but i can't get myself to sit down and write a damn essay



lol youre slowly turning into DFW

#38
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ahha, fuck that. fuck that and fUck you
#39
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#40
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