I must end my no-post-december to inform you that Nelson Mandela, noted anti-racist social-democrat, has ceased to be. No rude jokes, unless you're goatstein or you feel like it.
Superabound posted:now he and Thatcher can battle each other eternally in Valhalla
a version of the ring cycle but the plot is of the rise and fall of the ANC, the question is whether alberich is botha or some unspecified awful boer ancestor of his
EmanuelaOrlandi posted:lol
HenryKrinkle posted:
Thank you Bruce Springsteen, Run DMC, one of the Ramones (not sure which), Peter Gabriel, and Bonnie Raitt for liberating South Africa from imperialism.
Superabound posted:Hero = Terrorism + Success + Time
"Either you die a hero or live long enough to see yourself become the villain." -Nelson Mandela
Johannesburg - Struggle stalwart Winnie Madikizela-Mandela bitterly lashed out at Nelson Mandela in an interview published in the London Evening Standard this week.
She said South Africa's first democratically elected president, who is also her ex-husband, had become a "corporate foundation" who was being "wheeled out to collect the money".
Madikizela-Mandela also called Archbishop Emeritus Desmond Tutu a "cretin", in the interview with Nadira Naipaul, who visited her with her husband, the writer VS Naipaul, in Soweto.
"Mandela let us down," said Madikizela-Mandela.
'Bad deal for the blacks'
"He agreed to a bad deal for the blacks. Economically, we are still on the outside.
"The economy is very much 'white'. It has a few token blacks, but so many who gave their life in the struggle have died unrewarded," said Madikizela-Mandela, in the interview published on www.standard.co.uk.
She said Mandela had no control over the ANC anymore and was just being used by the Nelson Mandela Foundation to get funds.
"Look what they make him do. The great Mandela. He has no control or say any more. They put that huge statue of him right in the middle of the most affluent 'white' area of Johannesburg. Not here where we spilled our blood and where it all started.
"Mandela is now a corporate foundation. He is wheeled out globally to collect the money and he is content doing that. The ANC have effectively sidelined him but they keep him as a figurehead for the sake of appearance."
Others also suffered
Madikizela-Mandela said Mandela was not the only leader who suffered.
"This name Mandela is an albatross around the necks of my family. You all must realise that Mandela was not the only man who suffered. There were many others, hundreds who languished in prison and died.
"Many unsung and unknown heroes of the struggle, and there were others in the leadership too, like poor Steve Biko, who died of the beatings, horribly all alone.
"Mandela did go to prison and he went in there as a burning young revolutionary. But look what came out."
Madikizela-Mandela criticised him for accepting the Nobel Peace Prize with the apartheid government's last president, FW de Klerk.
"I cannot forgive him for going to receive the Nobel with his jailer de Klerk. Hand in hand they went.
"Do you think De Klerk released him from the goodness of his heart? He had to. The times dictated it, the world had changed, and our struggle was not a flash in the pan, it was bloody to say the least and we had given rivers of blood.
"I had kept it alive with every means at my disposal."
TRC 'charade'
She also lashed out at the Truth and Reconciliation Commission process, criticising Tutu, its chairperson.
"Look at this Truth and Reconciliation charade. He should never have agreed to it.
"What good does the truth do? How does it help anyone to know where and how their loved ones were killed or buried? That Bishop Tutu who turned it all into a religious circus came here.
"He had the cheek to tell me to appear. I told him a few home truths. I told him that he and his other like-minded cretins were only sitting here because of our struggle and me. Because of the things I and people like me had done to get freedom."
Looking back, she said the movement's actions were badly planned.
"You know, sometimes I think we had not thought it all out. There was no planning from our side. How could we? We were badly educated and the leadership does not acknowledge that. Maybe we have to go back to the drawing board and see where it all went wrong."
http://uhurunews.com/story?resource_name=winnie-mandela-on-nelson-mandela
gyrofry posted:Mandela Let Us Down
Johannesburg - Struggle stalwart Winnie Madikizela-Mandela bitterly lashed out at Nelson Mandela in an interview published in the London Evening Standard this week.
She said South Africa's first democratically elected president, who is also her ex-husband, had become a "corporate foundation" who was being "wheeled out to collect the money".
Madikizela-Mandela also called Archbishop Emeritus Desmond Tutu a "cretin", in the interview with Nadira Naipaul, who visited her with her husband, the writer VS Naipaul, in Soweto.
"Mandela let us down," said Madikizela-Mandela.
'Bad deal for the blacks'
"He agreed to a bad deal for the blacks. Economically, we are still on the outside.
"The economy is very much 'white'. It has a few token blacks, but so many who gave their life in the struggle have died unrewarded," said Madikizela-Mandela, in the interview published on www.standard.co.uk.
She said Mandela had no control over the ANC anymore and was just being used by the Nelson Mandela Foundation to get funds.
"Look what they make him do. The great Mandela. He has no control or say any more. They put that huge statue of him right in the middle of the most affluent 'white' area of Johannesburg. Not here where we spilled our blood and where it all started.
"Mandela is now a corporate foundation. He is wheeled out globally to collect the money and he is content doing that. The ANC have effectively sidelined him but they keep him as a figurehead for the sake of appearance."
Others also suffered
Madikizela-Mandela said Mandela was not the only leader who suffered.
"This name Mandela is an albatross around the necks of my family. You all must realise that Mandela was not the only man who suffered. There were many others, hundreds who languished in prison and died.
"Many unsung and unknown heroes of the struggle, and there were others in the leadership too, like poor Steve Biko, who died of the beatings, horribly all alone.
"Mandela did go to prison and he went in there as a burning young revolutionary. But look what came out."
Madikizela-Mandela criticised him for accepting the Nobel Peace Prize with the apartheid government's last president, FW de Klerk.
"I cannot forgive him for going to receive the Nobel with his jailer de Klerk. Hand in hand they went.
"Do you think De Klerk released him from the goodness of his heart? He had to. The times dictated it, the world had changed, and our struggle was not a flash in the pan, it was bloody to say the least and we had given rivers of blood.
"I had kept it alive with every means at my disposal."
TRC 'charade'
She also lashed out at the Truth and Reconciliation Commission process, criticising Tutu, its chairperson.
"Look at this Truth and Reconciliation charade. He should never have agreed to it.
"What good does the truth do? How does it help anyone to know where and how their loved ones were killed or buried? That Bishop Tutu who turned it all into a religious circus came here.
"He had the cheek to tell me to appear. I told him a few home truths. I told him that he and his other like-minded cretins were only sitting here because of our struggle and me. Because of the things I and people like me had done to get freedom."
Looking back, she said the movement's actions were badly planned.
"You know, sometimes I think we had not thought it all out. There was no planning from our side. How could we? We were badly educated and the leadership does not acknowledge that. Maybe we have to go back to the drawing board and see where it all went wrong."
http://uhurunews.com/story?resource_name=winnie-mandela-on-nelson-mandela
vilerat was right
“If there is a country that has committed unspeakable atrocities in the world, it is the United States of America. They don’t care for human beings.”
Via cbsnews.com
6. On Israel:
“Israel should withdraw from all the areas which it won from the Arabs in 1967, and in particular Israel should withdraw completely from the Golan Heights, from south Lebanon and from the West Bank.”
Via jweekly.com
5. On the U.S. war with Iraq:
“All that (Mr. Bush) wants is Iraqi oil.”
Via cbsnews.com
4. Mandela on Castro and the Cuban revolution:
“From its earliest days, the Cuban Revolution has also been a source of
inspiration to all freedom-loving people. We admire the sacrifices of the Cuban people in maintaining their independence and sovereignty in the face of the vicious imperialist-orquestrated campaign to destroy the impressive gain made in the Cuban Revolution….Long live the Cuban Revolution. Long live comrade Fidel Castro.”
Via lanic.utexas.edu
3. Mandela on Libyan dictator Muammar Gaddafi, his longtime supporter.
“It is our duty to give support to the brother leader…especially in regards to the sanctions which are not hitting just him, they are hitting the ordinary masses of the people … our African brothers and sisters.”
Via finalcall.com
2. On the U.S. preparing to invade Iraq in a 2002 interview with Newsweek.
“If you look at those matters, you will come to the conclusion that the attitude of the United States of America is a threat to world peace.”
Via newsweek.com
1. On a Palestinian state:
“The UN took a strong stand against apartheid; and over the years, an international consensus was built, which helped to bring an end to this iniquitous system. But we know too well that our freedom is incomplete without the freedom of the Palestinians.”
Via cbsnews.com
Mandela sounds pretty LF to me
My friend James Deciuttis once asked me very directly, “Are you ever wrong?” It was not asked with bile, but very straightforwardly, as if asking if I ever had visited Spain.
I told James that if he referred to my writing, speaking, and political activism, I have made many bad calls and misjudgments. I can look forward to a brand-new year of them in just 28 days. In one particular case, however, I really blew it very, very, very badly. But I was not alone.
Like many other anti-Communists and Cold Warriors, I feared that releasing Nelson Mandela from jail, especially amid the collapse of South Africa’s apartheid government, would create a Cuba on the Cape of Good Hope at best and an African Cambodia at worst.
After all, Mandela had spent 27 years locked up in Robben Island prison due to his leadership of the African National Congress. The ANC was a violent, pro-Communist organization. By the guiding light of Ronald Wilson Reagan, many young conservatives like me spent much of the 1980s fighting Marxism-Leninism — from the classrooms of radical campuses to the battlefields of Grenada, Nicaragua, and El Salvador, both overtly and covertly. Having seen Communists terrorize nations around the world while the Berlin Wall still stood, Mandela looked like one more butcher waiting to take his place on the 20th Century’s blood-soaked stage.
The example of the Ayatollah Khomeini also was fresh in our minds. He went swiftly from exile in Paris to edicts in Tehran and quickly turned Iran into a vicious and bloodthirsty dictatorship at the vanguard of militant Islam.
Nelson Mandela was just another Fidel Castro or a Pol Pot, itching to slip from behind bars, savage his country, and surf atop the bones of his victims.
WRONG!
Far, far, far from any of that, Nelson Mandela turned out to be one of the 20th Century’s great moral leaders, right up there with Mahatma Gandhi and Dr. Martin Luther King Jr. He also was a statesman of considerable weight. If not as significant on the global stage as FDR, Winston Churchill, and Ronald Reagan, he approaches Margaret Thatcher as a national leader with major international reach.
MadMedico posted:
wow, its nice seeing so many conservatives come out so strongly against rape in the comments section. Thank you, pro-apartheid advocates, for supporting the Feminist cause!
lol
