Impper posted:
my theory is that iraq was transparently a national project by the US and its closest lapdogs whereas libya had broad-ranging support from all the west, truly a global initiative, resembling more probably serbia in this regard than iraq
I think a lot of people are buying into it because it was well timed (Arab Spring) to coincide with legitimate liberation movements and that there are these rebels to showcase as heros. I suppose the same could have been done in Iraq with Kurds or Shi'ites but the context was different (War on Terror).
discipline posted:
qadaafi did so much for libya. so. much. read a goddamn book.
Green Book
getfiscal posted:
i read parts of the green book when i was 13. it was cool.
one of the stories in gaddafis book is about how the city's basic level of organization leads to alienation, i bet he isnt thinking this now that he's relying on the terrain of tripoli to live
babyfinland posted:
Impper posted:
my theory is that iraq was transparently a national project by the US and its closest lapdogs whereas libya had broad-ranging support from all the west, truly a global initiative, resembling more probably serbia in this regard than iraq
I think a lot of people are buying into it because it was well timed (Arab Spring) to coincide with legitimate liberation movements and that there are these rebels to showcase as heros. I suppose the same could have been done in Iraq with Kurds or Shi'ites but the context was different (War on Terror).
yeah kurds and shi'ites just didn't fit that narrative that well, plus there was the issue of geography where the rebels could charge across the desert lawrence of arabia style
Impper posted:
i hope gaddafi dies by getting hit with a nato bomb then a gang of rebels & africans & one of his african mercenaries & one of his ukrainian female bodyguards cannibalize him, tearing the flesh away bit by bit and feeding him the marrow from his own bones - it would make his book my most prized possession. limonov could only pray for a death rivalling that
same
Impper posted:
one of the strangest things about libya is how people discount every accomplishment and metric of national progress, either because it's "welfare state and not socialist," or "libya had unfair advantages that true impoverished countries do not enjoy" and the first one is a strange criticism at the least and the second one is a plain lie. doesnt stop the same people who call for "nuanced views" from using both
given the choice between gaddafi or nato puppet state my answer is "no thanks!" cuz theyre both just as bad as each other dont you see
getfiscal posted:
Libya could have been a paradise and it would still be Right To Rebel. Liberal-democracy or death. Or liberal-democracy and death: Even better.
I got no problem with ousting Qadaffi or anything like that. Libya needs reform, no doubt about that. 5 month long bombing campaigns and rape gangs not so much
babyfinland posted:
I got no problem with ousting Qadaffi or anything like that.
That reminds me I have a cake but I want to eat it and still have the cake this dilemma confuses me.
getfiscal posted:babyfinland posted:
I got no problem with ousting Qadaffi or anything like that.That reminds me I have a cake but I want to eat it and still have the cake this dilemma confuses me.
don't play dumb donald. I mean if there's a truly democratic uprising as in Syria then fine, but this is a sectarian and NATO backed destruction of the entire society. There's a huge difference between the two (namely, the quality of the lives of thousands of normal people who just want to live decently)
getfiscal posted:
babyfinland posted:
I got no problem with ousting Qadaffi or anything like that.
That reminds me I have a cake but I want to eat it and still have the cake this dilemma confuses me.
By the waters
The waters
Of Babylon.
We lay down and wept
And wept
For thee Zion.
We remember
Thee remember
Thee remember
Thee Zion
i read this as you literally having a piece of cake and wanting to eat it, and got confused for a moment as to why you would share this information
http://www.mathaba.net/news/?x=628192
In the morning, Dr Franklin Lamb, director of the Americans for Middle East Peace, who has consistently put out live interviews from his hotel room where he has shared gathered intelligence and information with the YouTube community, was shot in the leg by a sniper while cycling near his hotel.
Mahdi Darius Nazemroaya, a researcher, also narrowly escaped death from a sniper targeting him as he stepped out of the hotel to place a sign saying "PRESS", and was additionally threatened by CNN journalists.
Thierry Meyssan, who runs the French VoltaireNet blog, said that from the Rixos Hotel, the order was given by so-called "journalists" from the United States to bring down Mahdi Darius Nazemroaya and Thierry Meyssan.
Edited by Crow ()
Edited by Crow ()
A political and education Libyan who was born in the city of Benghazi in 1966. Has a PhD in pivatisation obtained from the Academy of Economic Studies in Bucharest Romania. He occupied the position of Minister of Economy, Trade and Investment in Libya, and was the youngest minister to fill such a post. Before taking the ministerial position, he founded the Centre for Export Development in 2006 and became the first Director General for it. He also assumed the position of Director General for the Ownership expansion program (privatization fund) in 2005.
discipline posted:
I just imagine this barrage of rebels all selling interviews to western media mouthpieces, each with a claim more outrageous than the last.
and they're all doing it from the safety of qatar or whatever. literally all the msm sources were "reported from " and included mondo quotes from the ground
Impper posted:discipline posted:
I just imagine this barrage of rebels all selling interviews to western media mouthpieces, each with a claim more outrageous than the last.and they're all doing it from the safety of qatar or whatever. literally all the msm sources were "reported from " and included mondo quotes from the ground
On CNN today I heard the reporter go "For the latest on Libya, we go to Martha's Vineyard"
discipline posted:
qadaafi did so much for libya. so. much. read a goddamn book.
In the beginning, yes. When he was extolling pan-Arabism in the likeness of Sadat, one can make a case that he was a Chavez like figure in Libya.
Last 15 years, at least, have been a shitstorm as he's turned Libya into a rentier state that benefits his family almost exclusively. Trace the money: Qadaafi is heft investor in Italian, French, and American banking assets (including some that lost a great deal of their value in 2008) and yet he's done little to improve the educational infrastructure of Libya. Educated citizens would only upset his rule.
