http://www.thenation.com/article/163844/occupy-wall-street-most-important-thing-world-now
I love you.
And I didn’t just say that so that hundreds of you would shout “I love you” back, though that is obviously a bonus feature of the human microphone. Say unto others what you would have them say unto you, only way louder.
Yesterday, one of the speakers at the labor rally said: “We found each other.” That sentiment captures the beauty of what is being created here. A wide-open space (as well as an idea so big it can’t be contained by any space) for all the people who want a better world to find each other. We are so grateful.
...
halp me i'm drownig...
that's my story, thanks for skimming it uninterestedly
redfiesta posted:
this forum is fukkin terrified of a bunch of average people out-radical-ing themselves
its like there is this terrible, unspoken tension because facing with ows movement would only remind them their own failures
redfiesta posted:
this forum is fukkin terrified of a bunch of average people out-radical-ing themselves
considering that even the mention of the s-word is enough to get you kicked out/shouted down at most GAs there's really not much chance of that happening unless we're considering tepid left liberalism the height of radical politics
aerdil posted:
ive always hated naomi klein because her 'magnus opus' is just yet another tired left-of-center liberal retread of marx too ashamed to acknowledge that an icky communist forged the way originally and did so with a much clearer, more brilliant, and far more comprehensive analysis of capitalism
It really is cowardly and gross, but at the same time the FBI still spends a significant portion of its budget infiltrating Communist and Leftist groups and trying to entrap them and generally harassing them. It's done a really great job of choking leftism in USA. My friend's dad bought a bunch of USSR memorabilia for a themed birthday party like 6 years ago and has been on the no fly list ever since
aerdil posted:
redfiesta posted:
this forum is fukkin terrified of a bunch of average people out-radical-ing themselves
considering that even the mention of the s-word is enough to get you kicked out/shouted down at most GAs there's really not much chance of that happening unless we're considering tepid left liberalism the height of radical politics
ows is just the most recent example of the brand new politics in the 1st world that was brewing for sometime in spain and greece. it's radicalism does not come from how far the protestors willing to go to challenge the socio-economic system they are in, but rather from the way they conduct their political movement. the direct democracy and non-partisan, non-ideological inclusiveness of ows is born out of a deep distrust in liberal democracy and any other system of the 20th century. that's more radical and liberating than, say, anything a mtw worshipper came up with.
plus it's actually happening.
edit: stupid typos
Edited by redfiesta ()
redfiesta posted:
aerdil posted:
redfiesta posted:
this forum is fukkin terrified of a bunch of average people out-radical-ing themselves
considering that even the mention of the s-word is enough to get you kicked out/shouted down at most GAs there's really not much chance of that happening unless we're considering tepid left liberalism the height of radical politics
ows is just the most recent example of the brand new politics in the 1st world that was brewing for sometime in spain and greece. it's radicalism does not come from how far the protestors willing to go to challenge the socio-economic system they are in, but rather from the way they conduct their political movement. the direct democracy and non-partisan, non-ideological inclusiveness of ows is born out of a deep distrust in liberal democracy and any other system of the 20th century. that's more radical and liberating than, say, anything a mtw worshipper came up with.
plus it's actually happening.
edit: stupid typos
Edited by redfiesta (today 06:13:41)
so in the end, no serious challenge is posed to the socio-economic system? but hey, the protesters must feel really good about themselves in the end, that's what matters.
also, this is ridiculously ahistorical, since anarchists have been trying that for hundreds of years now and failing every single time the slightest breeze comes their way
redfiesta posted:
aerdil posted:
redfiesta posted:
this forum is fukkin terrified of a bunch of average people out-radical-ing themselves
considering that even the mention of the s-word is enough to get you kicked out/shouted down at most GAs there's really not much chance of that happening unless we're considering tepid left liberalism the height of radical politics
ows is just the most recent example of the brand new politics in the 1st world that was brewing for sometime in spain and greece. it's radicalism does not come from how far the protestors willing to go to challenge the socio-economic system they are in, but rather from the way they conduct their political movement. the direct democracy and non-partisan, non-ideological inclusiveness of ows is born out of a deep distrust in liberal democracy and any other system of the 20th century. that's more radical and liberating than, say, anything a mtw worshipper came up with.
plus it's actually happening.
edit: stupid typos
Edited by redfiesta (today 06:13:41)
this is nice, im gonna go to ows and say this to a cute girl
redfiesta posted:
ows is just the most recent example of the brand new politics in the 1st world that was brewing for sometime in spain and greece. it's radicalism does not come from how far the protestors willing to go to challenge the socio-economic system they are in, but rather from the way they conduct their political movement. the direct democracy and non-partisan, non-ideological inclusiveness of ows is born out of a deep distrust in liberal democracy and any other system of the 20th century. that's more radical and liberating than, say, anything a mtw worshipper came up with.
plus it's actually happening.
edit: stupid typos
Отредактировано by redfiesta (today 06:13:41)
lmfao
elemennop posted:redfiesta posted:
aerdil posted:
redfiesta posted:
this forum is fukkin terrified of a bunch of average people out-radical-ing themselves
considering that even the mention of the s-word is enough to get you kicked out/shouted down at most GAs there's really not much chance of that happening unless we're considering tepid left liberalism the height of radical politics
ows is just the most recent example of the brand new politics in the 1st world that was brewing for sometime in spain and greece. it's radicalism does not come from how far the protestors willing to go to challenge the socio-economic system they are in, but rather from the way they conduct their political movement. the direct democracy and non-partisan, non-ideological inclusiveness of ows is born out of a deep distrust in liberal democracy and any other system of the 20th century. that's more radical and liberating than, say, anything a mtw worshipper came up with.
plus it's actually happening.
edit: stupid typos
Edited by redfiesta (today 06:13:41)so in the end, no serious challenge is posed to the socio-economic system? but hey, the protesters must feel really good about themselves in the end, that's what matters.
also, this is ridiculously ahistorical, since anarchists have been trying that for hundreds of years now and failing every single time the slightest breeze comes their way
it's the "'brand' new politics" man ahaha
redfiesta posted:
Solidarity is just the most recent example of the brand new politics in Poland that was brewing for sometime in the USSR. it's radicalism does not come from how far the protestors willing to go to challenge the socio-economic system they are in, but rather from the way they conduct their political movement. the direct democracy and non-partisan, non-ideological inclusiveness of Solidarity is born out of a deep distrust in communism and any other system of the 20th century. that's more radical and liberating than, say, anything a mtw worshipper came up with.
Impper posted:
we're, like, post-ideological, man, know what i mean?
ugggggggggggggggggggggg
Impper posted:
we're, like, post-ideological, man, know what i mean?
(insert one of your favorite kierkegaard quotes about how worthless and without passion we all are)
Impper posted:
we're, like, post-ideological, man, know what i mean?
ahahha picture this as being said by Ernest. "We're, like, post-ideological, know what i mean, Verne?" ahahaha
redfiesta posted:
this forum is fukkin terrified of a bunch of average people out-radical-ing themselves
actually if rhizzone has any sort of ideological commitment its to not giving a rats ass as far as i can tell. no one cares about being revolutionary here. i think youre projecting
redfiesta posted:aerdil posted:
redfiesta posted:
this forum is fukkin terrified of a bunch of average people out-radical-ing themselves
considering that even the mention of the s-word is enough to get you kicked out/shouted down at most GAs there's really not much chance of that happening unless we're considering tepid left liberalism the height of radical politicsows is just the most recent example of the brand new politics in the 1st world that was brewing for sometime in spain and greece. it's radicalism does not come from how far the protestors willing to go to challenge the socio-economic system they are in, but rather from the way they conduct their political movement. the direct democracy and non-partisan, non-ideological inclusiveness of ows is born out of a deep distrust in liberal democracy and any other system of the 20th century. that's more radical and liberating than, say, anything a mtw worshipper came up with.
plus it's actually happening.
edit: stupid typos
I remember seeing an interview with that polish guy that I think you're talking about, and I think his perspective was a lot different than a lot of these neo-protest groups (and what can we call them?) like what those of Spain and OWS. That guy, or at least the guy I remember, talked about mass movements in terms of War by other means. He had no illusions about any trash like "post-ideology" or "Non-Ideological Solidarity" (and what the fuck is that even supposed to mean? it is an oxymoron)
IMHO Impper totally hit the nail on the head about what makes me feel so queasy about these OWS groups: that they feel less like revolutionary or even protest groups and more like a new form of collective identity politics, something more akin to having a brand loyalty than any kind of conviction. I don't why you would think they "remind me of my own failures" or how I'm supposed to be "terrified" of these people when I actually think they're a laughing stock.
elemennop posted:
redfiesta posted:
aerdil posted:
redfiesta posted:
this forum is fukkin terrified of a bunch of average people out-radical-ing themselves
considering that even the mention of the s-word is enough to get you kicked out/shouted down at most GAs there's really not much chance of that happening unless we're considering tepid left liberalism the height of radical politics
ows is just the most recent example of the brand new politics in the 1st world that was brewing for sometime in spain and greece. it's radicalism does not come from how far the protestors willing to go to challenge the socio-economic system they are in, but rather from the way they conduct their political movement. the direct democracy and non-partisan, non-ideological inclusiveness of ows is born out of a deep distrust in liberal democracy and any other system of the 20th century. that's more radical and liberating than, say, anything a mtw worshipper came up with.
plus it's actually happening.
edit: stupid typos
Edited by redfiesta (today 06:13:41)
so in the end, no serious challenge is posed to the socio-economic system? but hey, the protesters must feel really good about themselves in the end, that's what matters.
also, this is ridiculously ahistorical, since anarchists have been trying that for hundreds of years now and failing every single time the slightest breeze comes their way
revolution is a process, not an event bro. ows and similar movements will evolve and they will continue to gain strength over the years 'cause liberalism is in its death throes.
germanjoey posted:
I remember seeing an interview with that polish guy that I think you're talking about, and I think his perspective was a lot different than a lot of these neo-protest groups (and what can we call them?) like what those of Spain and OWS. That guy, or at least the guy I remember, talked about mass movements in terms of War by other means. He had no illusions about any trash like "post-ideology" or "Non-Ideological Solidarity" (and what the fuck is that even supposed to mean? it is an oxymoron)
IMHO Impper totally hit the nail on the head about what makes me feel so queasy about these OWS groups: that they feel less like revolutionary or even protest groups and more like a new form of collective identity politics, something more akin to having a brand loyalty than any kind of conviction. I don't why you would think they "remind me of my own failures" or how I'm supposed to be "terrified" of these people when I actually think they're a laughing stock.
who the fuck talked about post-ideology??? these movements come with their own ideological premises such as liberal democracy not working and direct democracy and pluralism being worthy goals to attain in a political movement. many of it's participants haven't realized that yet, but someone being ignorant of the implications of his/her own movement is hardly unique to ows.
"I'm at a loss for words. But even me being at a loss for words, is amplified. They want to know what the endgame is? This is the endgame. You doing your job, everybody here with a camera, everybody here with a smartphone, everybody here with a voice. Do your job, and spread the word. For the people who are sleeping here, you inspire us. If you are inspired by them, make it grow. This is the endgame. It's about growth now. We have to grow. And that's the point. I love y'all."
-Talib Kweli
what happens if the tree doesnt fall in the woods but everyone is there to see it and blog about it?
babyfinland posted:anyway enough of this dickwaving slapfighting bullshit
i agree
animedad posted:
haha:
"I'm at a loss for words. But even me being at a loss for words, is amplified. They want to know what the endgame is? This is the endgame. You doing your job, everybody here with a camera, everybody here with a smartphone, everybody here with a voice. Do your job, and spread the word. For the people who are sleeping here, you inspire us. If you are inspired by them, make it grow. This is the endgame. It's about growth now. We have to grow. And that's the point. I love y'all."
-Talib Kweli
what happens if the tree doesnt fall in the woods but everyone is there to see it and blog about it?
i see a thing at this and i mean it's funny, but i guess like, you don't begrudge it i guess? because idiots do things all the time, i suppose that this is just another dumb thing that will probably come to naught, but what are you really gonna do? what would talib kweli be doing instead of ows? making shitty music. what would the hippies be doing? they'd be hanging out in their ratty apartments instead of the public park; at least they're annoying people i suppose
redfiesta posted:
who the fuck talked about post-ideology??? these movements come with their own ideological premises such as liberal democracy not working and direct democracy and pluralism being worthy goals to attain in a political movement. many of it's participants haven't realized that yet, but someone being ignorant of the implications of his/her own movement is hardly unique to ows.
lol if these are truly the ideological foundations of ows they're even more worthless than i imagined. direct democracy in america wouldn't look anything like what they hope; i hope they have some maniacal bolshevist tendencies or they're not going to amount to very much
Impper posted:
i see a thing at this and i mean it's funny, but i guess like, you don't begrudge it i guess? because idiots do things all the time, i suppose that this is just another dumb thing that will probably come to naught, but what are you really gonna do? what would talib kweli be doing instead of ows? making shitty music. what would the hippies be doing? they'd be hanging out in their ratty apartments instead of the public park; at least they're annoying people i suppose
i begrudge it because it's another one of those false outlets for legitimate dissatisfaction, just show up and bang a gong for a few days and whew, this is it, this is the end game, here we go. we did it guys. we banged a gong. we can go home now, satisfied and happy. pass me my bottled water
sip
ahh
good thing we changed the world, eh
drwhat posted:Impper posted:
i see a thing at this and i mean it's funny, but i guess like, you don't begrudge it i guess? because idiots do things all the time, i suppose that this is just another dumb thing that will probably come to naught, but what are you really gonna do? what would talib kweli be doing instead of ows? making shitty music. what would the hippies be doing? they'd be hanging out in their ratty apartments instead of the public park; at least they're annoying people i supposei begrudge it because it's another one of those false outlets for legitimate dissatisfaction, just show up and bang a gong for a few days and whew, this is it, this is the end game, here we go. we did it guys. we banged a gong. we can go home now, satisfied and happy. pass me my bottled water
sip
ahh
good thing we changed the world, eh
well sure, but this is why we need maniacs, psychopaths, tramps, bums, and poets for the revolution
i give it another two weeks at the most before it either dissipates or gets completely co-opted by the Democrats in the coming election cycle
the best case scenario is an actually radical splinter protest group that grows after the police keep getting tougher
all of this is the perfect example of what zizek means when he describes "false action"
Impper posted:
animedad posted:
haha:
"I'm at a loss for words. But even me being at a loss for words, is amplified. They want to know what the endgame is? This is the endgame. You doing your job, everybody here with a camera, everybody here with a smartphone, everybody here with a voice. Do your job, and spread the word. For the people who are sleeping here, you inspire us. If you are inspired by them, make it grow. This is the endgame. It's about growth now. We have to grow. And that's the point. I love y'all."
-Talib Kweli
what happens if the tree doesnt fall in the woods but everyone is there to see it and blog about it?
i see a thing at this and i mean it's funny, but i guess like, you don't begrudge it i guess? because idiots do things all the time, i suppose that this is just another dumb thing that will probably come to naught, but what are you really gonna do? what would talib kweli be doing instead of ows? making shitty music. what would the hippies be doing? they'd be hanging out in their ratty apartments instead of the public park; at least they're annoying people i suppose
honestly id probably go and talk to some cute girls if i knew anyone else that was going. i might bring a flask of whisky and bullshit about politics w/ some of the less dumb people there. beats going to the bar or another shitty party
animedad posted:Impper posted:
animedad posted:
haha:
"I'm at a loss for words. But even me being at a loss for words, is amplified. They want to know what the endgame is? This is the endgame. You doing your job, everybody here with a camera, everybody here with a smartphone, everybody here with a voice. Do your job, and spread the word. For the people who are sleeping here, you inspire us. If you are inspired by them, make it grow. This is the endgame. It's about growth now. We have to grow. And that's the point. I love y'all."
-Talib Kweli
what happens if the tree doesnt fall in the woods but everyone is there to see it and blog about it?
i see a thing at this and i mean it's funny, but i guess like, you don't begrudge it i guess? because idiots do things all the time, i suppose that this is just another dumb thing that will probably come to naught, but what are you really gonna do? what would talib kweli be doing instead of ows? making shitty music. what would the hippies be doing? they'd be hanging out in their ratty apartments instead of the public park; at least they're annoying people i supposehonestly id probably go and talk to some cute girls if i knew anyone else that was going. i might bring a flask of whisky and bullshit about politics w/ some of the less dumb people there. beats going to the bar or another shitty party
i heard its poppin today. i just went to the website and this came up:
http://occupychi.org/2011/10/07/our-proposed-demands/#more-879
lol. there is like one thing on there that is revolutionary in the least, the rest is cretinous reform