#2081
Post rating: ~

ilmdge posted:

Dimashq posted:

That fool Macron has decided to intervene in the Syrian conflict and is going to station troops in the North to deter further Turkish encroachments in Kurdish territory.

I dont think theyre going to do that.



you're right, headlines i saw were inaccurate last night

#2082
Post rating: +
mwaaaahh the french military aid has always been celebrated for its excellence... there is a new intervention by macron, inspired, by that same french excellence
#2083
UNUSUALY COOL
Post rating: +
If someone in the Trump administration tries to push for leaving the Syrian government undestroyed as official stated policy, many others in and around Trump's admin will push back as reps of the Washington foreign policy consensus, and it will, at the very least, lead to another round of embarrassing firings/resignations & deep state fuck-overs because the U.S. intel & security forces, both military and civilian, will be extremely pissed at a group they want to believe they've mostly forced back on track after their slight deviations in rhetoric following the 2016 election.

It's funny, because a more standard-model bourgeois type than Trump might be able to pull some "Nixon-to-China" shit with Damascus (though they almost certainly never would), but this admin's discipline over its members started off poor and got worse. I don't know if anyone thinking about it under Trump would try anyway, but it would stand a good chance of collapsing into a huge mess.

Foot-dragging below the waterline on what to do about the Syrian government seems a lot more likely, because that can be stretched out until the 2018 elections or further. Honestly, I think any politician suddenly transposed into Trump's place might try that at this point anyway, because the Wash consensus's plans in Syria are kind of fucked now, and they could only make the admin look bad if they were pursued, which, if it's Trump's administration, would be a win for much of the Wash consensus and the intel/security agencies, regardless of how little daylight there really is between the rival groups in D.C.
#2084
Online
Post rating: ~


already a dozen liberals posting russia memes and begging for more war

as are "officials"

Top Pentagon and State Department officials on Tuesday said the U.S. won't be leaving Syria anytime soon, even as President Trump indicated the same day that he wants to pull U.S. troops from the war-torn country.

U.S. Central Command head Gen. Joseph Votel said "well over 90 percent" of land once held by the Islamic State in Iraq and Syria (ISIS) has been liberated, particularly in the north and eastern portions of the country, but that the military must maintain its presence there.

Edited by ilmdge ()

#2085
Post rating: +
Trump wants out, chemical attack in Ghouta a couple days later? And then within 24 hours discussion of limited intervention and airstrike packages? The whole media apparatus is cheering for blood.

Also Russia warned that any missile launches that result in Russian servicemen deaths will result in a counter strike on the launching platforms, i.e. some US destroyers mayyyy be getting broadsided by some anti-ship missiles in the next 48 hours. There were reports that SU-24s were scouting the eastern Mediterranean at low altitudes yesterday.
#2086
Online
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😱
#2087
Online
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Dimashq posted:

Trump wants out, chemical attack in Ghouta a couple days later? And then within 24 hours discussion of limited intervention and airstrike packages? The whole media apparatus is cheering for blood.


Even on reddit they seem to be figuring this latest attack to be bs
https://www.reddit.com/r/syriancivilwar/comments/8aru2r/syrian_foreign_ministry_every_time_the_syrian/
Top rated thread, good op

#2088
UNUSUALY COOL
Post rating: +++++
from khamseks twitter
#2089
UNUSUALY COOL
Post rating: +
#2090
Post rating: +

A Syrian opposition activist based in the town of Douma says most of those killed in the poison gas attack over the weekend have been buried.

sorry guys, you just missed them!!

#2091
Post rating: +
well that's that then, it's completely impossible to find a freshly dug mass grave, when you bury things in the ground they go to a mysterious undetectable null space whose properties have barely been theorized by cutting edge physicists, no further investigation is possible or necessary.
#2092
Post rating: +
I’m having trouble phrasing this in a way that doesn’t sound strident or concern troll-y, but even though I appreciate the Moon of Alabama guy’s analysis, sometimes I get kind of a “Red Larouchie” vibe from his site and I wish there were more English alternatives to his posts on the ME. The more-or-less blatant antisemitism that he allows in his
comments sections creeps me out in particular. In any case I just tried to read what he has on the latest incident and the site’s down, so the jokes on me
#2093
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Ruzbihan posted:

though I appreciate the Moon of Alabama guy’s analysis,


I have no idea what is going on with that place or where the heck it came from

#2094
Post rating: ~
From the comments section of some other site apparently?? Yeah there’s a lot that’s odd about it. Pinning down his actual politics is also pretty difficult, I’ve spent some time in vain trying to figure that out.
#2095
UNUSUALY COOL
Post rating: ~
REVIEW: Moon of Alabama's usual post template is to imply that pretty much anyone who started out life as something other than an anti-imperialist, then changed their mind and became an anti-imperialist later, is a spy sent by the government to destroy the world. 11/10
#2096
UNUSUALY COOL
Post rating: +

A Syrian opposition activist based in the town of Douma says most of those killed in the poison gas attack over the weekend have been buried.



activists say the rest of the bodies declined to appear for personal reasons

#2097
Online
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cars posted:


That seems like it could possibly be important. On the other hand



#2098
Online
Post rating: +
Lol guess who turned up in the replies to that spectator index post


#2099
Post rating: +
hell, with a source like @DarthPutinKGB i'm starting to think these propornot guys might be onto something
#2100
Post rating: +
anyone remember if tucker carlson is one of the fox personalities trump watches?

im thinking back on that jon stewart episode of Crossfire, credited with ending the show, and how it delighted me at the time. it's gonna be so wild when tucker winds up being the one to have exerted a more positive and humane effect on world affairs

ed: probably should include a link

Edited by Constantignoble ()

#2101
Post rating: +
get tucker carlson an account
#2102
UNUSUALY COOL
Post rating: +
fuck jon stewart
#2103
Online
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Constantignoble posted:

anyone remember if tucker carlson is one of the fox personalities trump watches?

im thinking back on that jon stewart episode of Crossfire, credited with ending the show, and how it delighted me at the time. it's gonna be so wild when tucker winds up being the one to have exerted a more positive and humane effect on world affairs

ed: probably should include a link


too bad hes a white supremacist! broken clock right on syria i guess

#2104
Post rating: +
i mean, he's got a tv show funded by one of the world's larger media capitals, so i figured it goes without saying he's a white supremacist
#2105
Online
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creepy.
#2106
Post rating: +
Throughout this whole conflict it’s been absolutely terrifying how the military has been the more “moderating” force while the western media has been pretty unanimously calling for immediate and uncompromising full scale land war since day one.
#2107
Online
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In response to the allegations, Syria said it has invited the Organization for the Prohibition of Chemical Weapons (OPCW) to investigate the suspected poison gas attack, which opposition activists say killed 40 people and wounded hundreds over the weekend.

However, a US official told The National, that while “Washington welcomes the OPCW mission, it will not affect the US decision on a response to Syria.”
#2108
Online
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#2109
Post rating: ~
the balls on these fucking yanks
#2110
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actually, according to this video from NATO's belgium HQ, the yank is the greatest selfless hero. God bless
#2111
[account deactivated]
#2112
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I get what you're going for there but I think you're ceding too much ground to make a point that can be defeated very easily by someone saying "well two wrongs don't make a right" (nevermind the irony of saying that in defence of military action). Better I think to point to the absurdity of the US refusing to allow the proper international body to investigate the truth of claims made by one side of a civil war, the side that happens to be in league with al qaeda, and insisting on pushing ahead with military attacks in defence of said al qaeda affiliates
#2113
UNUSUALY COOL
Post rating: +
there's also the point that HenryKrinkle made recently on the Other Site which is: the left should point out that, given how the world is set up at the moment, there's no legitimate justification for the U.S. to intervene even if Syria's government had used chemical weapons, that the United States and its NATO/Middle East allies serve to advance imperialism, not as a globally agreed-upon law enforcement agency.

but IMO there is no contradiction between making arguments about both rules and instances, and pretty much anyone on the left (or that I'd count among the left, for whatever little that's worth) would agree with the 'rule' part above anyway, they just also know that it's probably going to take a lot longer to convince others of that idea, given the vague media line about "international law" that only becomes relevant once it can be used for U.S. policy goals, and, in specific, the narrative set up by the Democrat opposition right around 2006 that it would have been fine to destroy Iraq and kill hundreds of thousands of people (at least) if someone had found a crate of unused, decades-old mustard gas shells somewhere in the ruins of Baghdad.

And it really is a good idea to get as many people as possible to be suspicious and angry about a bombing campaign that'll probably start any day now. The best strategy to show people they can stop something bad, something that seems out of their hands and over their heads, is to do what little you can to help them stop it, and as soon as possible. This isn't just some debate over long- vs. short-term strategy, and it's not much of an excuse to do nothing if you just say the left isn't as big or powerful as you might like when you look around you.

so if this Ghouta business and the U.S. reaction to it looks like bullshit as an instance, and it really does look as bullshit as the U.S. in 2003 telling inspectors to stop inspecting and get the hell out of Iraq before the U.S. started a bombing campaign that was "justified" by what the inspectors weren't going to be allowed to confirm, well then... Call bullshit on it. Everyone can understand that part at least. What recently happened in the media with the Porton Down argument, in a country that's even more traditionally deferential to its security services than the U.S., demonstrates that there's a place to push even if it hasn't budged much yet. If appointed experts won't get 100% in line with the desires of those who appointed them, it can cause some amount of friction, which is better than none, and it adds up, we've seen that before.

back in 2003, even my little anarcho child brain figured the U.S. government was going to try to take advantage of the chaos they created through destroying Iraq to claim that the weapons & facilities were there when the U.S. kicked the UN out, but had all disappeared because of the war, which is exactly what they did try to do, and just because Washington couldn't sell it after the fact back then doesn't mean the current government can't sell it now. I mean, let's face it, if high-profile liberals and the liberal press were going to apply the lessons learned in the destruction of Iraq, they'd be openly, vocally critical about a situation where the U.S. says it's going to start bombing just in case they might find a "good" reason to do it later. And you can bet that any location in Syria that might be claimed later by the U.S. government to store or produce chemical weapons is going to be blasted into dust before anyone can get a definitive look at it.

So now's probably the time to suggest that, given past experience, everyone should be as skeptical as possible about claims by the U.S. government in this area, especially when they plan to settle any dispute by vaporizing the supposed evidence, and to argue that skepticism should be applied here, now, to this event.
#2114
UNUSUALY COOL
Post rating: +
Like... think about the odds and ends that people in the Bush administration tried to leak out to the press after the invasion of Iraq to prove "There really were weapons of mass destruction in Iraq." Then think about how far the line has been pushed back since then (no one is talking about "mass destruction" anymore), and think about how much more aggressive the Trump administration would likely be with lies about what they find in the rubble, just outright brazen lies, given their activity in that area to date.

The reason there wasn't massive support from Western military & agency officials for the Bush people's post-invasion line was because the Bush White House, even when it still commanded Congressional support, couldn't muddy the water enough to make it worthwhile, and muddying the water is maybe the only talent shown to date by those working under Trump relative to those who worked under Bush. They don't have to be popular to get consensus in areas where the Democratic Party establishment, the military and the intelligence/security agencies agree with them already, and the Trump people know it will make them look good in tough election years ahead if they can offer evidence of victories in areas where their opposition can't or won't advance strong criticism.

The main error among high-profile Democrats, whose once-and-future strategy is to cheer on the deep state, is their too-hopeful belief that the figures and groups within the deep state have Democrat-friendly or Clinton-loyalist principles, that they don't want an excuse to collaborate more directly with the people in the White House who order bombings, invasions and assassinations, whoever those people happen to be. That's the opposite of the truth, and by the evidence; the deep state wants to discipline and condition annoying elements of the federal executive in the U.S. far more than they want to ruin their plans overall, because of 1) the general lack of daylight between the big actors in Washington on foreign policy and 2) the simple fact that the Trump administration is probably going to have its finger on the trigger until 2021 at the earliest.

And given the news over the last couple weeks, it seems to be working, right? I mean, what's the downside for the deep state? Is the DNC likely to want to take the shadowy figures that are nominally on their side right now and throw them under the bus? The deep state wins no matter which party takes Congress in 2018 or the White House in 2020. Their agenda remains the same, and it's what's being enacted right now in U.S. policy toward Syria.

The only proper and effective response to it is to point out how these are the same old lies as before, because the response to Iraq, no matter how useful it was for the Democrats, was a real and lasting setback for the people who told those lies. Failing to hammer that home is just despair, and it's worse than useless.
#2115
Online
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#2116
Black Belt
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During a reactionary war a revolutionary class cannot but desire the defeat of its government.This is axiomatic, and disputed only by conscious partisans or helpless satellites of the social-chauvinists.

To repudiate the defeat slogan means allowing one’s revolutionary ardour to degenerate into an empty phrase, or sheer hypocrisy!
#2117
Black Belt
Post rating: +
Bellingcat arguing the SAA threw chemical bombs out the back of a troop transport helicopter
#2118
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all of these people saw The Rock 20 years ago and forever after "chemical weapons" has been their activation code phrase

Edited by kamelred ()

#2119
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Has there been any videos of helicopters or planes dropping the chemical weapons? I figure with all these spotters and what not, somebody would think to video tape government hilcopters flying over rebel controlled areas
#2120
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there was but russians hacked it (((