discipline posted:

I thought you were told to stop using the word "dictator"

You are crazy people though

discipline posted:

it always amuses me how people say "oh well there's nothing I can do to help" and don't even try. I'm speaking on an anti-imperialist panel at Left Forum and am involved with organizing an anti-imperialist group in New York. maybe it's not perfect but it's a start. I hope to demoralize the enemy at home, which I think is important.

you know that makes no difference whatsoever and it definitely doesnt make you or your arguments better than anyone else's come on now

discipline posted:

I don't know, I think it does make a difference. you aren't just handed an opportunity in life to do something. organizing takes a lot of time, energy and effort. you have to start somewhere.

it does not make a difference

discipline posted:

it always amuses me how people say "oh well there's nothing I can do to help" and don't even try. I'm speaking on an anti-imperialist panel at Left Forum and am involved with organizing an anti-imperialist group in New York. maybe it's not perfect but it's a start. I hope to demoralize the enemy at home, which I think is important.

I'm not actively involved in anti-war stuff at the moment because literally nothing exists in my city and I'm unemployed, I used to be involved during the Iraq war in upstate NY and when I was in Greensboro.

Anyway thats not the point it's that American's stance on Assad's government is irrelevant to the outcome of the war no one here is "lifting a finger to help the victims of US brutality and rapacity defend themselves" in anything except the sense of 'moral support' unless they are sending money to Syria or going themselves

Edited by Lessons (April 30, 2014 19:08:08)

RedKahina posted:

RedKahina posted:

Lessons posted:
In any case of course the crimes of the US are worth opposing on a sort of moral/humanitarian basis, but what makes their opponents worth supporting, for me, rather than declaring a pox on both their houses, is that there's actual socialist or liberatory potential in that opposing project.
.

Shouting "a pox on both your houses" is not building a left alternative to anything.

"Ni, ni" is the kind of thing the petty bourgoisie in the imperial core likes to say while in fact diligently reproducing the empire they claim not to support and tirelessly vilifying its victims and - as you have been doing here rather histrionically - viciously denouncing anyone who expresses the least sympathy for the targets of imperial terror torture plunder as complicit in all kinds of evils they and their empire they don't really support are simply obliged, or at least perfectly licensed and right, to chastize.

RedKahina posted:

RedKahina posted:
RedKahina posted:
Lessons posted:
In any case of course the crimes of the US are worth opposing on a sort of moral/humanitarian basis, but what makes their opponents worth supporting, for me, rather than declaring a pox on both their houses, is that there's actual socialist or liberatory potential in that opposing project.
.
Shouting "a pox on both your houses" is not building a left alternative to anything.


"Ni, ni" is the kind of thing the petty bourgoisie in the imperial core likes to say while in fact diligently reproducing the empire they claim not to support and tirelessly vilifying its victims and - as you have been doing here rather histrionically - viciously denouncing anyone who expresses the least sympathy for the targets of imperial terror torture plunder as complicit in all kinds of evils they and their empire they don't really support are simply obliged, or at least perfectly licensed and right, to chastize.

US paramilitary proxies in Syria kidnapped children to gas them for the cameras in a psyop to entertain and seduce the imperial core commentariat, upon whom the paras and their managers had to be able to rely to make the whole horrific project possible and worthwhile. If there weren't all these volunteer US pr people runnning around wailing about the evil Assad, such horrific sadistic operations would be pointless and the imperial paras wouldn't be carrying them out. You make this kind of aggression and these umimaginably barbaric crimes possible. The "Assadsbelosevich is no boyscout!": routine you and so many others are running is an indispensible component of the imperial terror.

Cut it out.

Lessons posted:

That feel when the internet weirdo you were arguing with outs themselves as a complete lunatic

See there you go. You pretend you don't really support the UUS imperial aggressionn but you're a propagandist whose job is to go around shreikking about Milosassabollahsevic the monster and denying US terror torture death squads, foaming at the mouth with your zeal for every crude fable from Amanpour

discipline posted:

it always amuses me how people say "oh well there's nothing I can do to help" and don't even try. I'm speaking on an anti-imperialist panel at Left Forum and am involved with organizing an anti-imperialist group in New York. maybe it's not perfect but it's a start. I hope to demoralize the enemy at home, which I think is important.

are you going to start at the forum by demanding that everyone publicly announce their support of the lion assad?

RedKahina posted:

Lessons posted:
That feel when the internet weirdo you were arguing with outs themselves as a complete lunatic


See there you go. You pretend you don't really support the UUS imperial aggressionn but you're a propagandist whose job is to go around shreikking about Milosassabollahsevic the monster and denying US terror torture death squads, foaming at the mouth with your zeal for every crude fable from Amanpour

Oh shut up, your infowars crap does more to discredit anti-imperialism than all the anti-war activists admitting they don't like Saddam combined.

Lessons posted:

I exposed the CIA plot to kidnap and gas babies to my graduate seminar, not one of them even tried to dispute my flawless logic and superior ideology. Now tell me, "comrade", what have YOU done to fight imperialism lately?

You claim to be informed about Syria but plainly you are not reading any actual Syrian journalists. Try Sharmine Narwani. As for your quaint faith that the CIA and/or US contras would never hatch a plot to hurt anyone, certainly not children, you can read just about anything on any post WWII US proxy war eg http://www.amazon.com/Washingtons-War-Nicaragua-Holly-Sklar/dp/0896082954 or http://www.amazon.com/Degraded-Capability-Media-Kosovo-Crisis/dp/074531631X or http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Operation_Cyclone or http://www.michelcollon.info/IMG/article_PDF/article_a3234.pdf or http://www.amazon.com/Rwanda-New-Scramble-Africa-Imperial/dp/1926824946 and on and on

RedKahina posted:

Lessons posted:
I exposed the CIA plot to kidnap and gas babies to my graduate seminar, not one of them even tried to dispute my flawless logic and superior ideology. Now tell me, "comrade", what have YOU done to fight imperialism lately?

You do realize also when you descend to this - just a kind of sarcastic tic reaction where you hope the letters "CIA" alone wrapped in snark will make you sound wise and confident, as if you are aware of the real power of the empire and CNN supporting you, the signs of what Freud called repression are very obvious, like "oh right sure respectable gentlemen like Dora's father and his friends were molesting their daughters! rrrright!" followed soon by "you should be locked up and lobotomized for even suggesting such a thing about these fine citizens!" What you are repressing is not only the knowledge that the CIA as well as the US military and US contra paramilitaries do torture children to death but that the reason you want to deny it is cowardice, sadism and self interest.

RedKahina posted:

RedKahina posted:

Lessons posted:
I exposed the CIA plot to kidnap and gas babies to my graduate seminar, not one of them even tried to dispute my flawless logic and superior ideology. Now tell me, "comrade", what have YOU done to fight imperialism lately?

You do realize also when you descend to this - just a kind of sarcastic tic reaction where you hope the letters "CIA" alone wrapped in snark will make you sound wise and confident, as if you are aware of the real power of the empire and CNN supporting you, the signs of what Freud called repression are very obvious, like "oh right sure respectable gentlemen like Dora's father and his friends were molesting their daughters! rrrright!" followed soon by "you should be locked up and lobotomized for even suggesting such a thing about these fine citizens!" What you are repressing is not only the knowledge that the CIA as well as the US military and US contra paramilitaries do torture children to death but that the reason you want to deny it is cowardice, sadism and self interest.

do you have any more reason to believe that the CIA kidnapped and gassed babies for the newsreels than that the boston bombing was a false flag attack designed to retarget american fears towards russia? i think it's more likely that the US media and state apparatuses simply capitalized on something that wasn't pre-planned, or worked to produce an environment in which bad shit is almost certainly going to happen. people talk about the iowa writer's workshop as a CIA project. that doesn't mean that the writers there had CIA handlers or even that they would necessarily have written anything differently from what they would have otherwise, but rather that it promoted a certain style and approach that was preferred. another example, the US is one of the major arms dealers in the world so they have a way of inserting themselves into groups that want weapons and never have to do anything themselves. is there a difference? i guess that depends on your priorities. does it make a difference whether or not the boston bombing was hatched in an FBI boardroom and then a stooge was found versus the story that you hear in the media? maybe not to you but i think it's an important difference to keep in mind.