#81
Post rating: ~
It's good that you have access to a good community garden! Too bad other people aren't putting those plots to use.

If you have access to a community lot or garden that isn't shitty and you can totally afford it then go for it!

Just don't make yourself deal with overpriced plots or jerks to grow some food when you can do it on your balcony. You don't need a lot of space to grow food. I'm thinking about people living in the city on rice and beans and stuff.
#82
Post rating: +
it's almost like the people have been systematically deprived of knowledge of farming and connection with the land and can no longer support themselves without wage labor??
#83
Post rating: ~
i too support neufeudalismus and the massive expansion of labor required to farm sustainably.
#84
UNUSUALY COOL
Post rating: +
i like gardening and everything but this seems like the sort of thing you'd want to spring on people after the people's revolution rather than leading with it as some sort of selling point
#85
Post rating: ~
I'm in disapproval of the discussion of a useful and productive skill set because I don't think it's the right time to talk about it yet. The people's revolution hasn't happened.

We have to wait.
#86
UNUSUALY COOL
Post rating: ~
thats a weird opinion for you to have and doesnt resemble mine
#87
Post rating: ~
Maybe you should clarify then because I really don't understand what the heck you're talkin' bout.

#88
UNUSUALY COOL
Post rating: ~
i'm saying that right now this is a lifestyle niche interest and so i guess i'm just witnessing the transition of the rhizzone into the gardening discussion phase
#89
UNUSUALY COOL
Post rating: ~
i mean thats cool and all, im starting some tomato seeds right now, and im also waiting for christ to come again in glory, so i feel you
#90
Post rating: +
thats a lot healthier than discussing world events we have limited knowledge of or control over
#91
UNUSUALY COOL
Post rating: ~
so far we all seem to be on the same page then
#92
Post rating: ~
It starts as a hobby and then you eventually find yourself buying less and less produce dude. That's how it works.

Just because you're doing it for fun at first doesn't make it bad. It's good to have fun with something like this.
#93
UNUSUALY COOL
Post rating: ~
how do you propagandize this plan where everyone starts growing their own food
#94
Post rating: ~
Well, for Americans I would spin it on the whole self-interest fad going on. People like that idea of being independent and selling a point of food independence would be huge.

You could convey these concepts telling people they don't even need to buy anything except the seed starters in most cases they just need to find proper discarded materials to get started.

People nowadays really like the idea of frugality and making something from nothing.

What would really sell all of this is a demonstration of these techniques. When you get your garden going really nicely you can show it to people and describe some of the concepts to them and inspire them. (Especially if you didn't spend a lot of money on it!)
#95
UNUSUALY COOL
Post rating: ~
i feel a lot of people, a lot of wage workers specifically, would point out that they feel it's in their self-interest to have someone else grow their food because they don't want to do it and they don't want to spend their rare leisure time working in a garden because it doesn't interest them
#96
UNUSUALY COOL
Post rating: ~
i also wonder at even your most conservative setup for apartments vs. landlord/tenant law in many places in this country, as I mentioned, where anything involving soil would probably be an excuse to charge a departing renter for renovating the entire rental
#97
UNUSUALY COOL
Post rating: ~
to give you the context here this is a debate that is currently going on within the church over a vatican initiative and i'm raising the same issues here as there, i think it's completely proper for marxists to demand personal virtue and subsidiarity as well, i'm just curious how you plan to sell it
#98
[account deactivated]
#99
UNUSUALY COOL
Post rating: ~
tpaine, would you ever garden the shit out of some carrots
#100
Post rating: ~

daddyholes posted:

i feel a lot of people, a lot of wage workers specifically, would point out that they feel it's in their self-interest to have someone else grow their food because they don't want to do it and they don't want to spend their rare leisure time working in a garden because it doesn't interest them



Well the thing about these techniques is that they don't have to be labor intensive at all. You can set your balcony garden up in a way where you only have interact with it maybe once a month at most with wicking beds/pots and ollas systems. This is assuming that you get like no rainfall on your balcony and you have to do all the watering yourself too. Maybe like an hour a month? Setting up initially will take up some time and it isn't very fun but it's a good investment. The leisure in this comes from interacting with your garden every once in a while to pick some greens or veggies or to water it and see how everything is growing.

If you have a shitty landlord the best thing you can do is demonstrate that your gardens are individual objects much akin to potted plants and can be moved around. A friend of mine has successfully moved most of his garden from one apartment to another and his previous landlord was ecstatic about it and he wasn't charged for renovations at all.

So , say you do have a shitty landlord. You could have your potato tower sitting on some contraption with wheels (a small dolly of some sort) to demonstrate that you can move it around and it's temporary like a potted plant. The same thing with hanging vegetables in a vertical garden. Also with a box growing herbs.

I would imagine as more people attempt to grow food for themselves and see how messed up the system is and how it actually antagonizes people who try to grow their own food, there would at least be awareness of the issue and that's all I can realistically hope for.

#101
[account deactivated]
#102
UNUSUALY COOL
Post rating: ~
thanks that is actually useful. i remain a devil's advocate in both spheres because i have yet to see a way to present this to most people in a way that doesnt seem like, "hey guess what, here's some more work for you to do", which doesnt seem like something thats going to be useful for non-christian socialism to advance its cause and its hard enough to present it in a christian context where you still have to remind well-meaning bourgeois colleagues about class and leisure and production and the poor widow in the temple, but my tip from my college days is to disguise anything outdoors as something pet related and pay your pet fee because landlords are much less likely to bug tenants over animals than over plants in my experience
#103
Post rating: ~
I completely understand daddyholes. What I would recommend is to use some of the techniques I described and to demonstrate them to yourself first. Maybe along with your tomatoes you can plant some garlic and other cheap stuff from the grocery store.

Here's a list of stuff you can grow from food scraps:
http://wakeup-world.com/2012/10/15/16-foods-thatll-re-grow-from-kitchen-scraps/

Just do it whenever you have the time and can manage to remember. It gradually becomes habitual and it doesn't take up much time at all.


#104
UNUSUALY COOL
Post rating: ~
well its more a matter of bringing this to other people in my case tsinava, i dont need convincing, i both have the time and like to do this
#105
Post rating: ~
Well, I would start telling people about wicking pots/ollas and growing stuff from grocery scraps first.

You're essentially using a bunch of trash and it doesn't take up much time to set up. It's pretty approachable and you can expand from there.

Potato towers/food towers would be next, and those don't have to be huge they can be like 2ft tall if you want.

Basically start with whatever is easiest to put together and is the cheapest regarding time/money.
#106
Post rating: ~
I really think the best way to convince people is for them to see it themselves. There are so many people out there who are convinced they couldn't grow shit and it's not true. Everyone can grow stuff.
#107
[account deactivated]
#108
Post rating: ~
Here's a diagram of a wicking pot I drew just to demonstrate how simple they are:



Just get a pot without a hole at the bottom or a bucket and fill it partially with gravel/rock/pumice/whatever and stick a small pipe in it or a bunch of straws that reach the very bottom. Then put the torn up t-shirts over the reservoir in a nice layer and then the soil over that then you fill the reservoir.

So you need:
1. soil
2. container that water wont leak out of
3. gravel/rocks
4. torn up t-shirts or some kind of cloth
5. small pipe/straws
6. whatever you're planting in it

and of course water

Edited by tsinava ()

#109
[account deactivated]
#110
Post rating: ~
This is really weird. I thought t-paine was a good poster or something.
#111
[account deactivated]
#112
Post rating: ~
well. to be fair. no one here is a good poster. inlcuding me
#113
[account deactivated]
#114
Post rating: ~
please stop making bad posts.

they trigger me.

im having anxiety attacks
#115
Post rating: +
i fucking love rhizzone ag threads and i fucking love tpaine posts. everything owns
#116
[account deactivated]
#117
Post rating: ~
i was joking too lol. I wasn't actually having anxiety attacks I'm just pretending to be some tumblr weirdo. it's just my bad form of humor. sorry.
#118
[account deactivated]
#119
Post rating: ~
man does this "irony" stuff sure get out of hand here at tHE r H i z z o n E sometimes.
#120
Post rating: ~
dubble poast