Ironicwarcriminal posted:discipline posted:I had a cool conversation with my german friends about this stuff last night, they are from the GDR and are scared of communism. also my german friends always bring up soviet rape it's weird
Not sure why that's weird. Like if an indigenous friend was always bringing up colonial dispossession i'd understand why
it's weird because rather than talking about the way more widespread crimes of enslavement and extermination that was German national policy down to the regular everyday functioning of small towns, they tend to focus on a tragic side-effect of having an invading army which squared against the most brutal genocidal force in modern European history (for which there is plenty of competition!). so, yes, while it's a tragic side-effect, it has nothing to do with colonial dispossession unless you are talking about the systemic dispossession of colonies from the fascist German empire.
as in, raping and pillaging was not Soviet policy, despite whatever propaganda nonsense that is pushed, and that, while the German invasion forces were universally despised and reviled, the Soviet occupation is seen with a much more complicated view. while the countryside experienced alot of problems with drunken and hungry Soviet soldiers, the urban forces were much more under effective central control and in many places were seen much more favorably than Americans (who came off as aloof due to official policy barring them from interacting with the locals). For more info, read The Making of the GDR: 1945-53 by Gareth RR Pritchard
littlegreenpills posted:i'm finding donald's trolling (goblining) (kobolding) (vodyanoing) to be compelling and instructive as we have to think hard about all the different ways we could potentially become wrong or be seen as wrong
i find donald willfully misunderstands what people mean when they talk about 'cults' as it is a universal modern phenomenon little to do with political specificity and more to do with ethical excess
discipline posted:also you have to patiently explain that the ability to travel is a privilege that not many have
the 'patiently' bit really ties the sentence together
oh wait lol
According to Rosstat, fewer than 0.5% of the Russian population have been abroad since 2001. Comparatively, some 13.8% of people in the world travelled overseas in 2010. This discrepancy reflects the fact that the vast majority of Russian travellers come from the relatively small but expanding class of middle-income consumers as well as the ultra-rich.
wow what a privilege!
discipline posted:haha maybe should start our own marxist-leninist party. it's still a forum with front page articles but also a platform and suggested reading page. then we can coordinate with people in our geographic locations or whatever. this would be a radical experiment with party feedback, the upvote and downvotes and home pages etc, oh... hello mr. fbi, welcome to tHE rHizzonE
please see a doctor
jools posted:that's fair enough really. russia is a huge place, why would you need to travel abroad
because that's like a central piece of anticommunist propaganda in Russian and the former Soviet & socialist states. in the Soviet days, you couldn't travel abroad easily. nevermind that Soviet citizens traveled extensively within the diverse Soviet Union, the biggest country in the world. or the fact that now the visa bureau is even more byzantine to the average Russian (as is much of the bureaucracy).
anyway, most people can't travel beyond their town due to the economic situation, much less take advantage of traveling to different parts of Russia.
thanks for putting the positive spin on it! You'll do good work in the embassy
jools posted:anyway so crow are you arguing that communism was good because people couldn't travel abroad but capitalism is bad because people can't travel abroad
are you being a moron or just english?
maybe you should problematise germans talking about soviet rape rather than treating it as you have done, something to be just dismissed or minimised or whatever....
jools posted:maybe you should problematise germans talking about soviet rape rather than treating it as you have done, something to be just dismissed or minimised or whatever....
i'm saying the german rapes are a much deeper problem than a political specificity of Soviet Socialism, and that the way the debate is framed is symptomatic of anticommunist ideology, the same one that "dismisses or minimizes" atrocities against Eastern Europeans during World War II. Thanks for playing
Crow posted:jools posted:maybe you should problematise germans talking about soviet rape rather than treating it as you have done, something to be just dismissed or minimised or whatever....
i'm saying the german rapes are a much deeper problem than a political specificity of Soviet Socialism, and that the way the debate is framed is symptomatic of anticommunist ideology, the same one that "dismisses or minimizes" atrocities against Eastern Europeans during World War II. Thanks for playing
what are you even trying to argue here, your brain is broken
jools posted:okay, so you could travel abroad easily in the ussr because it's even harder now??? ZUhh???/
yes you could travel the USSR and socialist states much easier all things considered than you can now, at least for the majority of the population. Do you know something I don't know about this? Please, educate me
jools posted:Crow posted:jools posted:maybe you should problematise germans talking about soviet rape rather than treating it as you have done, something to be just dismissed or minimised or whatever....
i'm saying the german rapes are a much deeper problem than a political specificity of Soviet Socialism, and that the way the debate is framed is symptomatic of anticommunist ideology, the same one that "dismisses or minimizes" atrocities against Eastern Europeans during World War II. Thanks for playing
what are you even trying to argue here, your brain is broken
hahaha I forgot you have literacy difficulties, but I'm afraid I'm at a loss how to dumb this down for you. Hmmmm, well, let me try: maybe you should stop trying to weigh in authoritatively on things you have no grasp of. You know the old slogan: Take your bitter ass to twitter!
discipline posted:jools posted:well you just dismissed it as weird so i dunno discipline, i dunno
no I meant that the fact I've heard about it from every single german I've ever known is pretty weird
why is it weird
Crow posted:jools posted:Crow posted:jools posted:maybe you should problematise germans talking about soviet rape rather than treating it as you have done, something to be just dismissed or minimised or whatever....
i'm saying the german rapes are a much deeper problem than a political specificity of Soviet Socialism, and that the way the debate is framed is symptomatic of anticommunist ideology, the same one that "dismisses or minimizes" atrocities against Eastern Europeans during World War II. Thanks for playing
what are you even trying to argue here, your brain is broken
hahaha I forgot you have literacy difficulties, but I'm afraid I'm at a loss how to dumb this down for you. Hmmmm, well, let me try: maybe you should stop trying to weigh in authoritatively on things you have no grasp of. You know the old slogan: Take your bitter ass to twitter!
you dont know shit crow, you don't read anything
time out bro
Edited by babyhueypnewton ()
jools posted:Crow posted:jools posted:Crow posted:jools posted:maybe you should problematise germans talking about soviet rape rather than treating it as you have done, something to be just dismissed or minimised or whatever....
i'm saying the german rapes are a much deeper problem than a political specificity of Soviet Socialism, and that the way the debate is framed is symptomatic of anticommunist ideology, the same one that "dismisses or minimizes" atrocities against Eastern Europeans during World War II. Thanks for playing
what are you even trying to argue here, your brain is broken
hahaha I forgot you have literacy difficulties, but I'm afraid I'm at a loss how to dumb this down for you. Hmmmm, well, let me try: maybe you should stop trying to weigh in authoritatively on things you have no grasp of. You know the old slogan: Take your bitter ass to twitter!
you dont know shit crow, you don't read anything
OOps, and here we have the CRUX of the problem! You're trying to weigh in on lived experience and family history on an issue you read about in, at most, a handful of books. Oopsy daisy! Guess you don't really know everything, do ya? I think, huey, we have located the fundamental problem with just sitting indoors and reading books all day...
discipline posted:jools posted:why is it weird
because it's always brought up in conjunction with a certain part of a conversation involving the merits of marxism, as if marxism is to blame for brutal rapists
what do you think informs their understanding of marxism in respect to this
Crow posted:jools posted:Crow posted:jools posted:Crow posted:jools posted:maybe you should problematise germans talking about soviet rape rather than treating it as you have done, something to be just dismissed or minimised or whatever....
i'm saying the german rapes are a much deeper problem than a political specificity of Soviet Socialism, and that the way the debate is framed is symptomatic of anticommunist ideology, the same one that "dismisses or minimizes" atrocities against Eastern Europeans during World War II. Thanks for playing
what are you even trying to argue here, your brain is broken
hahaha I forgot you have literacy difficulties, but I'm afraid I'm at a loss how to dumb this down for you. Hmmmm, well, let me try: maybe you should stop trying to weigh in authoritatively on things you have no grasp of. You know the old slogan: Take your bitter ass to twitter!
you dont know shit crow, you don't read anything
OOps, and here we have the CRUX of the problem! You're trying to weigh in on lived experience and family history on an issue you read about in, at most, a handful of books.
go back to wddp
Crow posted:Personal Reminder: check for cameras, so joolie don't tweet about my personal habits
Reading Books About Things So You Know About Them: A Personal Habit
jools posted:go back to wddp
I think you're much more welcome there, bud. I certainly don't want to be reading more of these stillborn tweets..
jools posted:so i guess the GDR made an honest historical reckoning in regard to the 500k-2m rapes by occupying soldiers in east germany then? i mean obviously any neglect in doing this would probably have pretty negative effects...
so which book about the GDR did you pick up this stunningly complex knowledge of the situation after the conclusion of hostilities?
Crow posted:jools posted:so i guess the GDR made an honest historical reckoning in regard to the 500k-2m rapes by occupying soldiers in east germany then? i mean obviously any neglect in doing this would probably have pretty negative effects...
so which book about the GDR did you pick up this stunningly complex knowledge of the situation after the conclusion of hostilities?
svetlana alexiyevich, war's unwomanly face
also richard overy discusses it a bit in his books on ww2 ive scanned through
the book you mentioned appears to mention rape all of three times???
Crow posted:here we have the CRUX of the problem! You're trying to weigh in on lived experience and family history on an issue you read about in, at most, a handful of books. Oopsy daisy! Guess you don't really know everything, do ya? I think, huey, we have located the fundamental problem with just sitting indoors and reading books all day...
