le_nelson_mandela_face posted:You're deeply confused. It isn't about if this will make the world a better place, and I never once even mentioned that. It is about what is honest, and punishing the bastards. You think we should lie because the consequences of the truth in the open might be suboptimal. But we can't make the world a better place with either candidate. Our best and only chance to punish just one of the bastards - and not just a random, replaceable nobody, as you claim, but in fact the Woke Slay Yaas Queen herself - is the election of Donald Trump. I'd throw the whole world in a furnace to get only a brief flicker of justice and you have no business claiming you're a revolutionary if you disagree
that's not the Leftist Case for Trump, that's the Misanthrope's Case for Trump. "yeah, we can't make the world a better place, but at least someone i hate will suffer and that'll sure show those phonies."
if you want to make the case that all these liberals screeching about the evils of Trump are ignoring that every president, regardless of party, has supported a system that has criminalized minorities, bombed the Middle East, waged economic war on the most vulnerable population... that would be a good leftist argument! and the parts of your post that explore this line in detail are good
but "Hillary is just as bad as the bogeymen that liberals screech about... ergo, we should vote for the Nazi candidate" doesn't follow. (and yes, in spite of years of "Bush = Hitler" invective, Trump is the Nazi candidate because of the overwhelming support he's gotten from Nazis and white supremacists. even back in 2008, Stormfront had actual arguments over whether to vote for McCain or Obama, since they assumed that McCain would be more deferential to the ZOG. there's no such controversy with Trump, he has their overwhelming love and respect).
back when the KPD was in full "social fascism" mode, it was never "the SPD and Nazis are both aspects of the same phenomena, ergo vote for the Nazis, at least they're honest and they'll jail Hilferding and the other SPD hacks." that'd be ridiculous, it was always around the need to organize around and fight for actual communism.
"but there is no viable communist, or even remotely leftist party in the US, so that option simply isn't feasible." it's true that no leftist party stands a chance in this year's election, but that doesn't mean you shouldn't begin the work of organizing. if one believes, as you said, that the various institutions of liberalism are in crisis, ignoring or even attacking the very people they claim to serve and care about, then there is going to be a need for leftists groups who can explain these crises and provide solutions. if not, then you're ceding that opportunity to people like Trump.
it doesn't even have to be a proper party! it can be a group dedicated to a good cause that you believe in. and the important thing is you can still embarrass liberals and expose their dishonesty. remember when BLM crashed those Hillary rallies? now she can't bring up black people in public without someone hitting her with her "super predator" remarks. even Trump nailed her with it at the last debate, but he wasn't the one who dug that up.
in conclusion, do not vote for Hillary, but do not vote for Trump. voting for fascists is generally not a good strategy for leftists
Aspie_Muslim_Economist_ posted:With Trump, you can cackle as he drives the elites insane. You can laugh as centrist liberals are forced into hypocritical, tortuous defenses of oligarchy, Bill Clinton's sexual predations, and a panoply of other horrors, and you can sneeringly say "I told you so" to your credulous left-liberal friends. You can gloat as one of a thousand utterly fungible venal politicians is punished for some technical peccadillo.
damn sounds pretty good....
shapes posted:that's not the Leftist Case for Trump, that's the Misanthrope's Case for Trump. "yeah, we can't make the world a better place, but at least someone i hate will suffer and that'll sure show those phonies."
if you want to make the case that all these liberals screeching about the evils of Trump are ignoring that every president, regardless of party, has supported a system that has criminalized minorities, bombed the Middle East, waged economic war on the most vulnerable population... that would be a good leftist argument! and the parts of your post that explore this line in detail are good
but "Hillary is just as bad as the bogeymen that liberals screech about... ergo, we should vote for the Nazi candidate" doesn't follow. (and yes, in spite of years of "Bush = Hitler" invective, Trump is the Nazi candidate because of the overwhelming support he's gotten from Nazis and white supremacists. even back in 2008, Stormfront had actual arguments over whether to vote for McCain or Obama, since they assumed that McCain would be more deferential to the ZOG. there's no such controversy with Trump, he has their overwhelming love and respect).
back when the KPD was in full "social fascism" mode, it was never "the SPD and Nazis are both aspects of the same phenomena, ergo vote for the Nazis, at least they're honest and they'll jail Hilferding and the other SPD hacks." that'd be ridiculous, it was always around the need to organize around and fight for actual communism.
"but there is no viable communist, or even remotely leftist party in the US, so that option simply isn't feasible." it's true that no leftist party stands a chance in this year's election, but that doesn't mean you shouldn't begin the work of organizing. if one believes, as you said, that the various institutions of liberalism are in crisis, ignoring or even attacking the very people they claim to serve and care about, then there is going to be a need for leftists groups who can explain these crises and provide solutions. if not, then you're ceding that opportunity to people like Trump.
it doesn't even have to be a proper party! it can be a group dedicated to a good cause that you believe in. and the important thing is you can still embarrass liberals and expose their dishonesty. remember when BLM crashed those Hillary rallies? now she can't bring up black people in public without someone hitting her with her "super predator" remarks. even Trump nailed her with it at the last debate, but he wasn't the one who dug that up.
in conclusion, do not vote for Hillary, but do not vote for Trump. voting for fascists is generally not a good strategy for leftists
I'm afraid you are mistaken. There is no hope and the world is, in a very real sense, doomed. You can organize your little committees and feel good and maybe even Make a Difference and then James O'Keefe will walk in with a video camera and an editor and Congress will destroy you and that will be end of it. Or the media will rip into your candidate the same way they did with Trump, except that Trump is a billionaire capitalist who wants to cut taxes and welfare so they'll do it faster and bloodier because they have more skin in the game than not wanting to pay their gardener minimum wage. Then the only question is what gets us first, the heat or the Democrats getting high on her own supply of Kremlin conspiracies.
So with that option out of the way we can at least go into oblivion fighting with spite in our hearts and bloody one of the bastards. It's really the small victories. Call me a pragmatist.
le_nelson_mandela_face posted:btw the Misanthrope's Case For Trump is that trump would kill more people
or whatever other stupid shit you want since "misanthropy" is not a position
le_nelson_mandela_face posted:but are still nonetheless firmly on Hillary's side in practice with our empty non-swing-state protest votes, because 4chan posters trolled us insanely hard
sounds rough for you, goondolences
by Petrol
No presidential candidate better represents the interests of a large number of Maoist, Anarchist and Trotskyist groups, not to mention the Occupy movement and leftist darlings Slavoj Zizek and Julian Assange, than the republican nominee, Donald Trump, because he too likes to ogle, intimidate, and sexually assault women and children.
le_nelson_mandela_face posted:You can organize your little committees and feel good and maybe even Make a Difference and then James O'Keefe will walk in with a video camera and an editor and Congress will destroy you and that will be end of it.
dude.. we realize that this article is the product of a traumatized bernie bro mindset. don't worry we still like you.
cars posted:le_nelson_mandela_face posted:btw the Misanthrope's Case For Trump is that trump would kill more people
or whatever other stupid shit you want since "misanthropy" is not a position
Nice erasure. Mods
le_nelson_mandela_face posted:Aspie_Muslim_Economist_ posted:
And not just a random, replaceable nobody, as you claim, but in fact the Woke Slay Yaas Queen herself
Lol, this doesn't make any sense. Hillary is a crude approximation of a human being onto which liberals project all that shit. There are a hundred future war criminals waiting in the wings that are better suited to being a vessel for college educated liberals' social media fetishization.
Be honest, goat; this is really about her atrocious comic timing, isn't it? When you saw the Pokemon go to the polls youtube something broke inside you and you swore your children would never have to endure four years of shitty, committee-written jokes told with excruciatingly bad delivery.
”It makes you want to turn off the news. It makes you want to unplug the internet or just look at cat GIFs,” Clinton told donors in San Francisco on Thursday, making her first remarks on Trump’s treatment of women since several came forward to accuse him.
“I’ve watched a lot of cats do a lot of weird and interesting things,” she said, drawing few laughs. “But we have a job to do. And it’ll be good for people and for cats.”
babyhueypnewton posted:This is pretty good. Let's remember that voting is a relatively unimportant activity in America which is mostly about liberal petty bourgeois identity formation (4 more years of smug!). By that standard these are more than enough reasons to vote for Trump instead of watching some rerun on TV. I would probably vote for trump if he promised to take John Oliver off the air, anything that further exposes the hypocrisy and class contempt of liberals is icing on the cake.
xipe posted:i shared this with friends unaccustomed to your work goatstein, its quite funny to see their reaction
insta_gramsci posted:it's extremely entertaining to argue the left case for trump with liberals
they get this little flicker in their eye, and then they accuse you of supporting sexual assault
lmao
glad to see the 'zzone getting back to its "lol triggered much libs" roots of 2011.
tpaine posted:please don't use "triggered" henry, it reminds me of my rape at gunpoint
you mean the one you got convicted on?
swampman posted:I'm writing an equally bad response piece to this
The Left Case For Hillary
http://www.bbc.com/news/election-us-2016-37667924
Petrol posted:The leftist case for Trumpvoting
by Petrol
No presidential candidate better represents the interests of a large number of Maoist, Anarchist and Trotskyist groups, not to mention the Occupy movement and leftist darlings Slavoj Zizek and Julian Assange, than the republican nominee, Donald Trump, because he too likes to ogle, intimidate, and sexually assault women and children.
that makes him PERFECT for trots
i mean i feel we should be honest about this.